VR6 POWER UPGRADES
			==================

Last update: Jul 25, 1995: Split into G60, GTI & VR6 archives.

I collected a bunch of info on engine power upgrades for the 
US versions of the Corrado SLC, VR6 Golf/GTI Jetta/Vento/GTX &
Passat GTX as they all share the same  VR6 engine.

I have also included personal impressions of these upgrades.
This is not meant as an advertisement. I have NO affiliation
with any of the listed sources.

I also included items from a posting by: 
tpaquette@ita.lgc.com (Trevor Paquette(Contract))

See also G60_Chip_Specs, Performance FAQ, G60_Power_Upgrades, 
GTI_Power_Upgrades, Wired_Hotrod, Intake_Mods, for more info.

jan@ug.eds.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------


HOW THE CHIP WORKS (G60 & VR6)
==============================

There are several shops that sell performance upgrades in the US
(and probably Europe as well).
One is by AutoThority (AT, in VA) the other by Automotive Perf. Systems 
(APS, in CA).
They both offer roughly the same packages, each of which boost
the power, though they use slightly different methods.
AutoThority also sells its chips (for less) thru AutoTech (CA)
and APS thru PlainWrap (for less) and others.

Note, there are also other chips available, such as from Advanced
Motor Sport solutions and Superchips. However, I have virtually
no testimonials about either of these, I cannot comment on their
efficacy.

Essentially what the chips do is to "recurve" the ignition
curves and fuel maps. 
According to an article in Wired magazine, the German chips
are generally programmed for smooth city driving while more
aggressive at the top end.
(see http://www.wired.com/Etext/2.05/features/silicon.hot.rod.html)
By advancing the ignition up to knock point you increase
power, most notably low end torque.
The result is ca 20% more low end torque and 10% more max power.
The penalty is that you have to use high octane gas, i.e., 
92 US CLC Octane (R+M/2).
Note that there is quite a debate now which chip is better.
According to a few sources, the AT chips are more delicately
tuned, while the APS chips are less radical.
APS also uses the same chip for their Stage II system while
AT offers different chips for each application.
AT also claims that they tune their chips along the entire range,
while APS concentrates more on the top end.
See the torque curves below for a comparison.

One of the things to keep in mind is that the chips are upgraded
from time to time and some of the initial comments may not be
true anymore...

Another thing to keep in mind is that the chips are not interchangeable
with other cars or even between model years. The maps are the same,
but the microcode in the chips are different.
The 92-93 Corrados with ECU code P & CD, using braker ignition use
the same chips, while the later 93 Corrado with brakerless ignition
use a different chip.

Passat, GTI & Jettas, apparently do not have a removable EPROM, and
require the thing to be soldered out.



OVERVIEW: SLC/VR6
=================

As of 1993, both APS & AA have been busy with performance upgrades
for the SLC. 
The first upgrade is a chip which works in the same spirit as the G60
power chips.
The improvement is not very dramatic (7 Hp more), but both APS & AA
claim it makes the car more drivable (a test below disputes this though).
The next upgrade is a throttle body.

The US throttle body has an air ramp right in front of the throttle
plate, restricting air flow. The upgrade (which is really the 
European TBody from VW) does not have that ramp, and they claim that 
the total package (chip + throttle + K&N filter) added 30 road Hps.
The throttle body is rather pricey (about US$ 300), and I 
you can't take your existing tbody and mill that ramp out because there
is not enough material in the casting.
Another difference is that the Euro TBody has a progressive mechanism
to open the throttle valve while the US has a direct hoockup.
This makes the low end more controllable but also seemingly softer
(IMHO).
The third difference is with the potentiometer. It is also different
but I don't know how.
Initial experiments have shown that the TBody & K&N actually improved
our gas mileage for sustained highway driving from about 26 mpg to
about 28 mpg. However, if you use the power, you will use more fuel
than before. YMMV.

Removing the airbox funnel will benefit performance & not produce the 
G60 wailing sound. See also Intake_Mods for more info.
The sound of the VR6 with the airbox modifications is awesome!
It's not overbearing on highway cruizing, and each time you accelerate,
you get this nice deep growl.

Later 93 Corrados require two airfilters if the original airbox is removed:
one for the intake, a second (the size of a 1/2 US$ coin) for the airpump.
The kit that APS, AMS, and so on sell for the VR6 Corrados consists
of a bracket and an 8inch cylindrical K&N filter, part number RE-0910.
If you are handy with sheet metal bending you can probably construct
yourself a bracket and save US$50. 

After these initial upgrades, it becomes increasingly more expensive
to produce more power. Probably, the next logical step are a new set
of camshafts such as those made by Schrick (US$1300).

After that, the Variable Inlet Manifold (US$2300) may be the next
logical choice. I

From an unconfirmed source [bernie@metapro.DIALix.oz.au (Bernd Felsche):
>No. The VW is *built* by a corporation. It is designed by engineers
>who probably get as much of a kick out of driving for pleasure as you do.
>Proof of that is in the VR6 option of a VSR (variable inlet manifold)
>providing much more torque in the mid-range and available from VW
>Motorsport. It has not appear in series production due to accountants.
>Nevertheless, the designers developed it further so that it could be
>offered as an "after-market" option.
See also VR6_Variable_Intake, VR6_Variable_Intake_MH & the Pictures
of it.
t improves mostly the mid-range.
The problem is that the combination of all of the above may not
work that well to gether, and a few tuners are working on it as I am
writing this.

There are now also kits being offered by Oetinger that change the intake
manifold, cams and a few other things.

There is also a Turbo charger available from Germany (for 6000US$)
that will boost the SLCs power to about 300Hp, making the car virtually
unmanagable.

Note that the new VW/Ford Van, the Sharan, is supposed to carry a
turbo charged version of the VR6 producing about 250 Hp.
No parts available as yet.


TORQUE CURVES
=============

The following data was inferred from the torque graphs supplied by
AutoThority (yes, I just eye-balled the values, but the resulting graphs
are fairly close to theirs).
The data is in ft/lbs, and it show, (US) G60 Stock, Stage 1, Stage 2, Stage 3,
and SLC Stock, SLC + AT Chip (SAT) and SLC + APS (SAP).

Note that I have no idea on the accuracy (or reliability)
of any of these measurements.


RPM     G60     AA1     AA2     AA3     SLC     SAT	SAP
1000    97      104     121
1500    117     124     147     147
2000    130     137     168     170			158
2500    140     147     182     190			161
3000    149     160     195     201     171     172	167
3500    157     165     197     204     183     186	187
4000    154     166     207     211     196     199	188
4500    156     162     200     205     197     203	208
5000    135     156     195     200     191     202	193
5500    135     145     175     195     185     188	180
6000    125     131     132     155     166     169	167
6500                    106     125			142

Using some smoothing, interpolation & making up some points,
I got the following curves:

G60:	Torque = 48.127 + 5.57E-2 x RPM - 7.19E-6 x RPM^2
AA1:	Torque = 52.964 + 5.76E-2 x RPM - 7.42E-6 x RPM^2
AA2:	Torque = 37.879 + 9.03E-2 x RPM - 1.22E-5 x RPM^2
AA3:	Torque = 32.821 + 9.23E-2 x RPM - 1.19E-5 x RPM^2
SLC:	Torque = 63.750 + 4.43E-2 x RPM - 1.62E-7 x RPM^2 - 7.21E-10 x RPM^3
SAT:	Torque = 68.374 + 3.55E-2 x RPM + 3.68E-6 x RPM^2 - 1.12E-9  x RPM^3

All the data fitted with 96% or better Pierson Correlation Coeff.
(Better fit with 3rd degree equation)


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
			IMPRESSIONS
			===========


P-CHIP for the !SLC!
====================

Subject: Corrado performance chips
From: ahogben@informix.com (Andrew Hogben)
Date: 6 May 93 17:17:08 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.
Originator: ahogben@mirage
Lines: 34


Last night I heard some interesting information in which Jan and a few others
might be interested.  My brother has a friend who owns a shop that, among
other things, has a rolling road dyno.  It seems when my brother was there
his friend was testing an SLC that had a Neuspeed "chip" installed (that was
the only mod).  Well, the results were very disappointing.  It had a gain
of *1* (yes, that's a _one_) horsepower at I don't remember what rpm.  It
actually *lost* 1-2 hp at other rpm and was no different over the rest of the
test (you can take your engine as high as you want, but if/when it goes bang,
it's your problem.  And yes, some engines do go bang :-).  In this case the
owner wanted the car tested to redline.  So, this is some concrete evidence
about one of the "chips" available for the Corrado.  One thing the dyno
obviously can't test is any change in drivability, but overall it doesn't
seem to be worth it in this case (at least IMO).


Andy
--
Andy Hogben
Informix Software, Inc.
ahogben@informix.com    -or-  {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!ahogben
'87 GTI 8v (weekdays)   -or-  '73 Lotus Europa Special (weekends)


---------------------------------------------------------------------------

From New Dimensions's BBS:
Probably TurboTim

We have tested all the Neuspeed chips and we show from 4-7 hp gain at
all rpm points. Will have to post the results of the dyno test for all
to read. The 6 cyl. chips works great! Just like your Golf chip did!
Tom, there is not a chip for the 1.8 16V. Bummer!!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------



From:  mshearer@math.ucla.edu (Michael Shearer)
Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1993 10:57:36 -0700 (PDT)
To: jan@lipari.usc.edu
X-Envelope-To: JAN@FSHPP1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT



BTW: I bought the AutoThority chip for my VR6...I'm probably going to
return it.  A LOT of pinging, even with 92 octane gas + octane
booster.  I haven't really noticed any jump in performance either.
Still want to do a little more testing, but it looks bad.

Mike
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: loik@balboa.eng.uci.edu (Matias Loikkanen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.vw
Subject: Re: Have you tried a P-Chip in your VR6?
Date: 14 Nov 1994 16:21:37 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 21
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References: <3a62j7$96f@newsbf01.news.aol.com>
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In article <3a62j7$96f@newsbf01.news.aol.com>, Saidra  wrote:
>I am thinking about buying a VW with a VR6 (Corrado, Jetta, Passat).  I
>keep having these fantasies about putting some mods on the engine.  Just
>enough to make it a little crazy but very drivable too.  I want to know if
>any of you have any advice on putting in a power chip or maybe a less
>restrictive air box.
>
I have the P-flow K&N air filter setup and also the throttle body --
sounds great but not convinced it gives me noticable hp improvement.
I also had the P-chip (all these from Neuspeed BTW) but took it out
since it went bad (something went wrong, I don't know what).  Well,
I notice absolutely no difference in power below 5500rpm.  Perhaps
it adds some in the very high (with the chip that is) end but I don't `
think it is worth it.  Other VR6 owners have said that these mods really
don't do that much ( to the G60 they do make much more of a diff).
Mat
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Mat Loikkanen    University of California, Irvine   loik@ece.uci.edu
                 Dept. of Elect. and Computer Egr.
1992 VW Corrado SLC
--------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Jan Vandenbrande
Date: Oct/Nov 94

I just installed the VR6 TBody on our 92 Corrado SLC as the first
power improvements (other than K&N) to this car.

It's an expensive piece of equipment, but buying directly from
PlainWrap you get a bit of break. The odd thing is, if you order
through plainwrap, APS actually ships it...so I wonder if PW has
become part of APS...Same box, shipping label == APS, etc.
I have never met the guys at PW, but my wife did while picking up a part.
They are a bunch of hard core racers and started this business (with
sales of computer software in the same office) to support their
racing expences.

Installation is about as easy as it gets, and took me under an hour
to do with some cleaning of parts included.

The main difference between the STock US TBody and the APS one is
that it does not have the restrictor in front of the throttle valve.
APS's TBody is nothing more than the one VW puts on their European
counter parts, and therefore it's a perfect fit. The part even says
VW on it and it is made by Pierburg (AAAHHHHH, memories of my Pierburg
Zenith 2B5 carb comes to mind, where is my shotgun).
Other differences are that the Euro/APS T body has a different
potentiometer and a different ratio to open the throttle.
The only adjustment to make is to adjust the accelerator cable.

Despite my earlier claims, you cannot mill out the old TBody and
remove that ramp. There is not enough material in the casting!
Now why did they do that for! Furthermore the potentiometer should
also be adjusted..
I also had a chance to look into the VR6 Intake Manifold, boy is that
surface rough! I looked into Extrude Hone before, but they are so
bloody expensive! They want 800 US$ to do the manifold, but they do
claim between 5 and 10% power gain.
Perhaps I should just spend a weekend pollishing it my self, if I
can figure out how to do it...(I kind-a now how but never tried it).
Anyone?

See the file VW_Perf_Time to see the differences.

The car is a bit more powerful, but mostly at the top end, the low
end is softer. It removed some of the "snap" that it used to have.
This may not be so much a loss of power, but rather may have more to
do with the variable or progressive rate at which the TBody now opens.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------


From: mcssechfs@dct.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Corrado Stage II vs SLC
Date: 11 Jun 93 11:37:48 +0100
Organization: Dundee Institute of Technology

>       Some of the VAG garages offer a 215bhp Corrado(Auto unfortunately).
>

Details of the above modification are as follows:-

        CVR6/3 Nothelle conversion.

        This conversion is relatively modest.  The standard bores and pistons
are retained giving a displacement of 2861cc.  Most of the work is confined to
the cylinder head.  Together with the manifold,which is modified to ensure
optimum gas flow.  The standard valves are opened by a pair of 274 degree
camshafts.  Camshaft design is one of Nothelle's specialities.

        The induction system from air intake to inlet manifold is carefully
smoothed and the engine management system has a modified control unit which
compliments the new parameters.

        These mods result in the power output being increased from the standard
190bhp to 215bhp.  Equally significant is the rise in maximum torque, from 180
to 201 lb ft.

        Maximum power is developed at 6000rpm and max. torque at 4250rpm.

        0-60  6.6secs

        Max speed 155mph

        power to weight ratio 181 bhp/ton>

        The car sits on 215/40 ZR16 's to get the extra power onto the road.


        Hope this of interest.  It will be to Jan!!

>                                               Chuck
>                                               Dundee
                                (signing off 1993, may the
                                force be with you.)
                                
                               

Article 24742 of rec.autos.vw:
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Path: lynx.unm.edu!umn.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!darwin.sura.net!howland.reston.ans.net!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!world!jhamill
From: jhamill@world.std.com (John A Hamill)
Subject: Re: [W] Corrado Queries
Message-ID: 
Keywords: SLC
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
References:   <2fn83tINNt1r@lynx.unm.edu>
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1993 00:08:37 GMT
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In article <2fn83tINNt1r@lynx.unm.edu> jan@camhpp12.ug.eds.com (Jan Vandenbrande) writes:
>In article  jhamill@world.std.com (John A Hamill) writes:
>John, how do you like the AT chip on the vr6? What effect? 
>Initial reports on the vr6 chips were rather negative.
>Considered the new throttle body as yet?

	The chip makes some difference, but not that dramatic. The engine
does seems to pull from low RPM's a little better, but then it did
anyway. The high end did improve, I  discovered that the engine comes
alive again at about 6000 and starts reving harder again. I got the 
most bang for the buck from the APS P-flow airfilter, it makes the
engine sound like a small block. Haven't considered the throttle
body, it's just too expensive for the hp gain in my view. I wonder
if a bunch of VR6's owners could make a group purchase and get any kind 
of discount. Back to the chip, no one advertises much of a gain with
chips for VR6 motors, VW probably did ok with the original programming.
I've noticed 1994 Corrados are speed limited to 130mph, if you have
to go faster a chip might be worthwhile. I think it is anyway though.
jh



Article 24714 of rec.autos.vw:
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From: alex@poa.poweropen.org
Newsgroups: rec.autos.vw
Subject: SUPERCHIPS G60 upgrade
Date: 26 Dec 1993 14:06:39 -0600
Organization: PowerOpen Association, Inc.
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Greetings,

Saw an ad for SUPERCHIPS in European Car that mentioned G60 upgrades.
Called them and asked for info.. Received a brochure in the mail. It
is full of silliness! For example...

picutre is of VR6 Corrado, not G60

"...the chassis is very competent and the 4 wheel drive system..."

"...the rev limiter is raised from 5800 RPM to 6500 RPM..."

random grammatical errors

Anyway...

They do offer 7 days' money-back guarantee, and a 12-month warranty (on what, 
who knows?). Quite a large list of dealers, including one in Boston, where I live.

Has anyone had any experience with SUPERCHIPS? Their material is a big turn-off,
but maybe the product itself is interesting....

I'm not really tempted to go with them over Neuspeed or AutoThority, but I hadn't
heard any discussion of SUPERCHIPS at all, so thought I would throw this out.

Happy solstice!

Alex
 


Article 24779 of rec.autos.vw:
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From: mshearer@abel.math.ucla.edu (Michael Shearer)
Subject: Re: [W] Corrado Queries
Message-ID: <1993Dec28.183739.13674@math.ucla.edu>
Keywords: SLC
Sender: news@math.ucla.edu
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In article  jhamill@world.std.com (John A Hamill) writes:
>In article <2fn83tINNt1r@lynx.unm.edu> jan@camhpp12.ug.eds.com (Jan Vandenbrande) writes:
>>In article  jhamill@world.std.com (John A Hamill) writes:
>>John, how do you like the AT chip on the vr6? What effect? 
>>Initial reports on the vr6 chips were rather negative.
>>Considered the new throttle body as yet?
>
>	The chip makes some difference, but not that dramatic. The engine
>does seems to pull from low RPM's a little better, but then it did
>anyway. The high end did improve, I  discovered that the engine comes
>alive again at about 6000 and starts reving harder again. I got the 
>most bang for the buck from the APS P-flow airfilter, it makes the
>engine sound like a small block. Haven't considered the throttle
>body, it's just too expensive for the hp gain in my view. I wonder
>if a bunch of VR6's owners could make a group purchase and get any kind 
>of discount. Back to the chip, no one advertises much of a gain with
>chips for VR6 motors, VW probably did ok with the original programming.
>I've noticed 1994 Corrados are speed limited to 130mph, if you have
>to go faster a chip might be worthwhile. I think it is anyway though.
>jh
>

I have the AT chip, although right now the stock chip is in the car. 
Using 92 octane gas (the highest grade which is readily available in CA), 
the following things occur:  low end (<3000rpm) improves noticably, above
3000-3500 knovking starts big-time if I'm more than, say, 20% throttle,
gas mileage seems to improve a little.  There are a few gas stations 
around where I can get higher octane fuel, but it's very expensive,
so I switch the chips out every once in a while.

I've been wondering if the P-flow would be worth buying.  Any more
info from John would be helpful (or Jan of course).  

Also, if the throttle body was cheeaper, I might give it a try.  I
suppose I'd rate my interest level about the same as John's.

Mike


Article 24834 of rec.autos.vw:
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From: jhamill@world.std.com (John A Hamill)
Subject: Re: [W] Corrado Queries
Message-ID: 
Keywords: SLC
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
References: <2fn83tINNt1r@lynx.unm.edu>  <1993Dec28.183739.13674@math.ucla.edu>
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In article <1993Dec28.183739.13674@math.ucla.edu> mshearer@abel.math.ucla.edu (Michael Shearer) writes:
>
>I have the AT chip, although right now the stock chip is in the car. 
>Using 92 octane gas (the highest grade which is readily available in CA), 
>the following things occur:  low end (<3000rpm) improves noticably, above
>3000-3500 knovking starts big-time if I'm more than, say, 20% throttle,
>gas mileage seems to improve a little.  There are a few gas stations 
>around where I can get higher octane fuel, but it's very expensive,
>so I switch the chips out every once in a while.
>I've been wondering if the P-flow would be worth buying.  Any more
>info from John would be helpful (or Jan of course).  
>Also, if the throttle body was cheeaper, I might give it a try.  I
>suppose I'd rate my interest level about the same as John's.

	I think the P-flow is a must have. However, I asked AutoThority
about using their chip with the P-flow and the throttle body, and the 
salemans eyes (I stopped by in Fairfax) kind of rolled back in his head
and he went into convulsions. He then started babbling about how their
programming can't/wouldn't work with the APS mods, seemed to imply my
engine might fry. Their chip works fine with the P-flow. If you are in
CA and having trouble with pinging, you would probably be much better
off giving APS a call and using their chip instead. Aaron doesn't seem
to be as aggressive in the timing modifications to the map and pinging
should be less of a problem. AutoThority is historically very aggresive
in their programming. They usually will re-program you a new less 
agressive chip if you are having problems.


Article 32475 of rec.autos.vw:
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From: e0ewqbwu@tuzo.erin (Roy Kao)
Subject: Oettinger kit for Corrado VR6
Message-ID: 
Sender: news@credit.erin.utoronto.ca (Usenet News)
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After finding the advertisement in this month's european car, I called
GTA in Quebec about the Oettinger kit for the VR6 engine.  You know what,
it's exact same modifications as in the car featured a few months ago
in this very magazine.  I called and found out that the kit cost about
$4,500 Cdn. and includes replacement camshafts and chips.
They don't have the correct filter box yet, but Louie, the guy in charge
of H2O cooled VW's, told me that the Neuspeed P-Flo will work fine.
They are also getting a new chromed header from Oettinger Technik.  BTW,
the grill that was featured in the article is also available as a kit 
for $450 Cdn.  The modifications will bump output to about 215 bhp and
about 192 ft. lb. torque.  Wowsers!!!  I can't wait until my warranty
runs out, who needs an M3 when I can have a 215 bhp VW!!!???  BTW,
the work must be done at a race shop VERY knowledgeable with VW engines
and electronics.
-- 
			    * Roy Kao			     *
			    *				     *
			    * e0ewqbwu@tuzo.erin.utoronto.ca *


Article 32542 of rec.autos.vw:
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From: kafka@cats.ucsc.edu (Gary Andrew Yuen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.vw
Subject: Re: Oettinger kit for Corrado VR6
Date: 20 May 1994 20:58:00 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
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In article <2rj69l$dtt@lipari.usc.edu> jan@lipari.usc.edu (Jan Vandenbrande) writes:
>In article  mvoorhis@zklzz.WPI.EDU (Michael C Voorhis) writes:
>>In article <2rikda$m54@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> kafka@cats.ucsc.edu (Gary Andrew Yuen) writes:
>>> I called GTA a while ago also.  That was before they advertised the
>>> kit and the guy I talked to mentioned that was one of the things
>>> available.  I think the VW Motorsport VSR manifold will yield more
>>> power though.  If you had that, new cams, P-Flow, and ask APS to
>>> create a custom chip from the one that comes with the VSR manifold, I
>>> think you would get more power than from that kit.
>>
>>Where does one get a VW Motorsport intake manifold, if one isn't in
>>Germany though?  I can't just order the thing from the dealership, and
>>I've not seen a place running ads for it at any time...
>>
>>What's the cost of the VW Motorsport variable inlet intake manifold in
>>US$, anyway?
>
>AutoTech (see the FAQ for #s) in San Juan Capistrano can get them
>for you (the guy whose used rims I bought for my SLC had one put on) 
>and I think New Dimensions was looking at one. 
>You can call VWMotorsport directly as well. See the faq...
>
>They are EXPENSIVE, about 2300US$. Comes with a new chip and stuff.
>However, the results are impressive, I think you get around 20Hp
>more at 3000 rpms but it leave the top end power about the same.

    The VSR manifold comes with a chip similar to stock that hasn't had 
it's fuel and timing curves tuned so I would think that you could ask APS 
to make a chip for that manifold and in addition to a few other parts, 
you could get more power than from the Oettinger kit which costs about $3200.


Gary



Article 32569 of rec.autos.vw:
Newsgroups: rec.autos.vw
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From: jhamill@world.std.com (John A Hamill)
Subject: Re: Oettinger kit for Corrado VR6
Message-ID: 
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
References:  <2rikda$m54@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> 
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 21 May 1994 14:13:23 GMT
Lines: 15

In article  mvoorhis@zklzz.WPI.EDU (Michael C Voorhis) writes:
>
>What's the cost of the VW Motorsport variable inlet intake manifold in
>US$, anyway?

	Probably a lot more than you want to spend. I heard they around $2000
a pop, if you can find one. I found with my SLC the best and most cost
efficient upgrades to get more power were just a chip and the P-flow. 
This combination makes about 190hp, and makes the engine sound great. 
I found this level of power adequate, although if I still had it
I probably would have sunk $1200 by now for the Schrick cams. Glad
I sold it.
 




Article 32578 of rec.autos.vw:
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From: e0ewqbwu@tuzo.erin (Roy Kao)
Subject: Re: Oettinger kit for Corrado VR6
Message-ID: 
Sender: news@credit.erin.utoronto.ca (Usenet News)
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In article <2rj4jd$dr4@lipari.usc.edu>,
Jan Vandenbrande  wrote:

>I sent these guys a fax asking for more info. Haven't received anything
>as yet.
>So they use camshafts, a chip, and another header (exhaust) to get
>more power? How's the idle and at how's the power band move, i.e.,
>at what rpms do we get the gain? How's gas mileage?
>
>Hey Mark H, when are you gonna tell us about your variable inlet manifold?
>Did the EC guys come around as yet?
>
>Jan -- using my school accound because our news server died.
>
>
>-- 
>-----------------
>Jan Vandenbrande
>jan@lipari.usc.edu			(Research address)
>jan@ug.eds.com				(Work address)

Jan, I'm at school right now so I don't have the exact data.  However,
I'll dig up the old "european car" issue, about March I think, where I
found the article and I'll find out more.  All I remember off the top
of my head though, is that it made 215 bhp, I don't know whether it is
SAE or DIN rating.  Some people have claimed that the VW Motorsport
intake manifold, at ~$2000 U.S. a shot, along with APS Neuspeed upgrades
is more cost effective than the $3300 U.S. GTA is asking for with
its Oettinger kit, do you agree?  I'm not sure that an intake manifold
along with the regular P-Flo, chip, and throttle body upgrades will
be better than replacing the camshafts and working within the engine
than around it.  I'd love the hear your comment, in the mean time, I'll
look for that article.  I'm not in a huge rush to do the upgrades, I'm
not crazy about voiding my last two years of warranty.
-- 
			    * Roy Kao			     *
			    *				     *
			    * e0ewqbwu@tuzo.erin.utoronto.ca * 


Article 35512 of rec.autos.vw:
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From: armstron@crl.com (Edward Armstrong)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.vw
Subject: Oettinger and the VR6
Date: 13 Jul 1994 11:09:04 -0700
Organization: CRL Dialup Internet Access
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <301ak0$esb@crl.crl.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: crl.com
Summary: VR6
Keywords: VR6

Hi  I few weeks ago I noticed a thread started by you Corrado guys  on the
Oettinger performance kit for the VR6. Well, I noticed that in the British
rag PERFORMANCE CAR they had an article about just this kit. I'll summarize
what I remember: Basically this kit is the standard performance stuff,
hotter cam and polished and slightly reworked intake and exhaust manifolds.
The writer said the low end was not improved but the mid and high range
were signifcantly improved. 0-60 mph droped a 1/2 second to the low 6
sec range.Power went from 190-->215 hp and torque was up too but I don't
remember the number. Anyway the writer/driver was generally impressed by
this performance upgrade. Price: expensive.
 This mag may be hard to find in North American non-urban areas. Its is an in- 
teresting forum for small fast cars like VW's etc and has lots of big color
photos. As a side note the article had some history on the Oettinger company.
Seems like they were big in the 80's with Gti and Audi performance parts.
In the 90's they took a nose dive and had to close. Just recently (1992?)
an ex employee reopened on a much smaller scale in the old warehouse.
The warehouse (near Frankfurt) is still appartently stock full of older
VW performance parts (send them over here!) including an engine that will
make your VW Transporter go 125 mph!
      --ed

----------------------------------------------------------------------------


From: New Dimensions
Left by:  TIM HILDABRAND               Replied #  129
Sent to:  VANDENBRANDE                   Status:  Public
  Topic:  AMS & G60 Woes                   Rcvd: 12-03-94, 16:56

>Stuff about AMS deleted<

Hey now this sounds like a testimonial for mark at AMS,
but experience with happy customers should be most important
when taking performance advise. The VR6 car you are
experimenting with is  equipped similar to ones we work with.
ND's first VR6 testing was done in August 92 on an 92 Passat .
We use all the Neupeed stuff that was available at the time
-p-chip -throttle body, modified air box with K&N filter, a
mildly ported intake manifold, and a ND sport stainless exhaust
system. This car produced 209 hp . The current VR6 test car is a
92 VR6 SLC. This car is equipped as above with the addition of a                
Neuspeed p-flow ,of corse  now it has the VSR manifold and 268
cams, the result is lost Neuspeed p-chip to use the VSR. The VSR
made good low end improvement but nothing good or bad in the top
end even with the cams. Quarter mile times we as follows- 1) all
Neupeed no VSR or cams 15.4 @90mph  2) w/ 80hp nos 14.3 @ 101 3)
Neuspeed with 268 cams w/80hp nos 14.2 @111
4) no p-chip w/VSR and cams no nos 14.89 @93  all test could
have been better but traction at start was always poor. Sorry
this car has not been dyno tested since it just had neuspeed
p-chip and throttle body at 200 hp. We will try to get some
testing done fully equipped VR6 sometime next year. This  test
car has none of the problems you have complained about no
pinging with and without VSR stuff. The performance of the car
is respectfully for the bolt on performance. True the manifold
and cams are too expensive for the gain . The low
end performance is so good  the top feels bad because it stays
the same, so if you what low end grunt buy it all. If
performance to the dollar is a concern just do the neuspeed
stuff. More than 210-215 will be hard if legality counts . 
 
CHIPS

  Neuspeed chips work, we have dyno tested , they work because
of 20 years dyno experience, knowledge of timing and fuel
curves. Curves that work for performance  and reliability needed
for all driving conditions. The process of burning, Give me a
break I bet most of you know that this process is simple. But
who had this knowledge first WHO CARES! If the burning knowledge
was worth royalties other people would be in line far before
Mark would. A division of VW of America came to Aaron for some
custom chip work  to help with idle problems on A3 Cabrios. Also
remember that Neuspeed has been making chips for VW's since 1990
when replacable e-proms  first appeared in VW's.


   Did Mark really say he expected to get 250 hp from cams Hey
this most be a misprint the European ABT  3.1 with cams, chip
and throttle body only gets 240 hp- go figure!!

>Comments on G60s deleted see the G60 archive<

  When looking for companies and products for you car, trust is
most important. Neuspeed has been producing good quality
products for a long time and should be around for along time to
come some other people in the business will not be. New
Dimensions has been in the VW business since 1985 -we do full
service and performance work at our shop.  We offer a 12 month
and 12,000 mile written warrantee on our work we have to sell
products that work or we have to make them work at our expense,
this does not happen with Neuspeed parts or we would not install
them. We test and install most everything we sell. Research of
performance parts is very important and a smart move on
everyone's part. Our new catalog will contain true test and
proven parts a service only availability from a service company.

 I have to say I am slightly  opinionated  I have been at ND
since 1987. We put a lot of effort to make good products
available. Usually only talking about positive things where ever
possible without slamming another product for there bad points.
Recently I have noticed more calls with customers saying Mark
basically sells his chip by slamming others, and most recently a
turbo customer said  Mark said our turbo systems caused too much
stress on the motor and his 16V system would not. Let get
something straight a properly used turbo car can be very
reliable, and abused one  will not. We have
over 1,000 units on the road (inc. Callway version)  I don't
believe the AMS systems has even sold two. How would someone
with so few systems tested have a right to rip a proven product
, simple you don't have any thing better to do. Mark seems to be
pretty smart when it comes to ideas but he should not try to
succeed by copying and smearing others and others products. Talk
is cheap but I don't believe there is much truth to the smear
claims.

                                                                
   Happy motoring 

                                                                
        Joe Funk

----------------------------------------------------------------------------


From <@camhpp49.ug.eds.com,@mail.uunet.ca:tom.neumann@canrem.com> Tue Oct 11 23:33 PDT 1994
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 1994 20:58:00 -0400
From: tom.neumann@canrem.com (Tom Neumann)
Subject: RE: CORRADO & OTHERS PROB
To: jan@camhpp49 (Jan Vandenbrande)
Message-Id: <60.16716.104.0C1B410E@canrem.com>
Organization: CRS Online  (Toronto, Ontario)
X-Envelope-To: jan@fshpp1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
Status: RO


Hi Jan!

I was recently speaking with Gunther Schmidt; he races the Jetta GLX
(VR6) quite successfully.

Engine mods allowed in his class are quite minor and he mentioned some
tips for the VR6 engine.

His, out of the box, and before balancing and blue-printing, got 184
hp on the dyno. He tore it down, balanced and blueprinted it and did 
two minor modifications: he changed to the K&N air filter (the free 
flowing one) and used the Passat manifold piece that connects the 
airbox to the intake manifold. He replaced the chip in the engine 
management system to eliminate the speed limiter (and swears that's 
the only change he made to it!).

The result of the above is 215 hp on the dyno with a good increase in 
midrange torque. I mentioned that some people had mixed reults with 
the free flowing air filter and he told me the secret of it: He found, 
through dyno testing and race experience, that the VR6 engine is quite 
sensitvie to the air temperature going into the air intake. When he 
just ran the filter in the normal engine compartment lots of hot air 
was going into the intake with the result that there was little, if 
any, power gain.

He made some ductwork that ducts air directly from the front of the 
car into the air filter (in his case on the racing car through the 
right headlight assembly) and noticed gains in the power immediately. 

You might want to mention this in the FAQ as it sounds like a way that 
most people will get some extra power. Obviously they wouldn't want to 
remove the headlight, but htere must be other ways to insure the 
filter gets fresh, cool air.

Tom
---
 * 1st 1.11 #3720 * I sell Volkswagens

Newer additions:
================
----------------------------------------------------------------------------



Article 5555 of rec.autos.vw:
Relay-Version: ANU News - V6.1B9 05/16/94 VAX/VMS V1.5; site bbs.ug.eds.com
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Newsgroups: rec.autos.vw
Subject: Re: Neuspeed VS "the others"
Message-ID: 
From: mvoorhis@inferno.WPI.EDU (Michael C Voorhis)
Date: 27 Apr 1995 14:23:22 GMT
References: <3mup8t$8hv@diplomatic.passport.ca> 
 	<3n9ldn$2o0@kelowna.awinc.com> 
 
Organization: RSUC -- Russell Street UNIX & Caffeine
NNTP-Posting-Host: inferno.wpi.edu
In-reply-to: jhamill@tiac.net's message of Sat, 22 Apr 1995 11:04:44
Lines: 12

I can't see spending %150 (or $100!) for a Neuspeed K&N fitler that
can be gotten directly from K&N for about $50.  Make the metal
retaining bracket yourself (sheet metal, a vice, a drill and a little
patience needed) and pocket the $50 or $100 you're going to save.

Here are two models:
RE-0910, 3" ID, OD from 4 5/8" to 5" and 8" long
RE-0930, 3" ID, OD from 4 5/8 to 6 and 6" long

	Mike (mvoorhis@wpi.edu)
	86 Jetta GL, 93 Corrado SLC, 67 Beetle



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed May 31 11:42 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 31 May 1995 11:29:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jan Vandenbrande 
Subject: Re: VR6 T-body Mods
In-Reply-To: ;
 from "Hulda Jowett" at May 30, 95 9:34 pm
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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> Jan, I'm suprised to hear that you had little gain w/ the 2.9 T-B. My 
> stock ported one feels great everywhere! I didn't add any material to the 

There is feel and there are measurements. 
The EuroTB feels a tad softer, especially at the low end but that just
may be due to the progressive mechanism. The high end seemed more
free flowing. 
But I am an engineer/scientist/whatever, and so I don't like to
rely on purely subjective impressions (e.g., louder cars seem faster,
brighter TV sets look sharper, etc).
What I usually measure is before and after acceleration figures,
and these obviously do not capture things like throttle responce:

92 SLC + K&N + Syntec
--------------------- [JHV]
2nd: 20-40 mph          3.07 - 3.40 secs
3rd: 40-60 mph          4.60 - 4.80 secs
3rd: 60-70 mph          2.89 secs
4th: 50-70 mph          5.64 secs

92 SLC + TBody + K&N + Syntec
------------------------------ [JHV]
2nd: 20-40 mph          3.42 secs
3rd: 40-60 mph          4.20 - 4.60 secs

My estimated error on these are .2 secs, unclear whether these measurements
are statistically significant.


In my 2nd gear test I got virtually no gain (actually a slow down!)
and in the 3rd gear test I am ahead about .3 secs.
Not much to brag about IMHO. Perhaps there are other things wrong
with the car. Also note that this is without a chip and
w/o a PFlow using just a replacement K&N airfilter element and
the Helmholtz resonators removed.
Some say the TBody does not get its fullest potential unless you have
the PFlow...

> away with out going through. How is the 2.9 progressive? I thought the 
> ramps in the stock T-B are what made it progressive. There's a small ramp 

The Euro TB does not have any of these air ramps. Instead of attaching
the accelerator cable directly onto the cam attached to the throttle,
there is a 2 (3?) link mechanism that slows opening of the throttle
from the closed position and speeds it up towards WOT. 
With this TBody, the car does not have this "jumpy" feel at idle.

--
              o   ___|___    [\\]    | Jan Vandenbrande          jan@ug.eds.com
   __0    /\0/   /-------\      _    | "For once I'd like to encounter an alien
   \<,_  O  \\  (_________)  .#/_\_. | being that is not immune to bullets"
(_)/ (_)    //  [_]     [_]  |_(_)_| | The Brigadier, Dr. Who.

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue May 30 18:45 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 30 May 1995 21:34:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Re: VR6 T-body Mods
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Jan, I'm suprised to hear that you had little gain w/ the 2.9 T-B. My 
stock ported one feels great everywhere! I didn't add any material to the 
dimple in mine. There is actually Quite a bit of metal that can be ground 
away with out going through. How is the 2.9 progressive? I thought the 
ramps in the stock T-B are what made it progressive. There's a small ramp 
on the top which I also ground away. No polishing, just cleaned it up 
afterwards with a dremel. I was always led to believe that polishing was 
a waste of time since the air along the walls is stagnant. later


Brian A. Jowett
93 VR6


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri May 26 20:38 PDT 1995
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Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 23:31:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: VR6 throtle body mods
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I'm new here so you may already know this. You can port the stock t-body 
on VR6s. I did mine just the other day, and I am very pleased with the 
results. Throtle response is improved from idle on up, and high rpm is 
better than ever. 
You can only grind so far, so its not as big as the 2.9 t-body. But hey 
it dosn't cost $350 either.

I also made my own cone type air filter. K&N part no. RE0810 fits 
excellent, costs about $45.00. Make a braket yo-self. Oh yeah, no air 
pump on my car. Hope to save somone some money. See ya.

Brian 93 SLC
hjowett@nasc.mass.edu


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Jun 14 14:10 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 14 Jun 1995 16:57:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Re: P-Flo thoughts....and a question.
In-Reply-To: <9506141811.AA25978@csupomona.edu>
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Who needs a machine shop to make a braket? I bent a bracket at home in my 
vise. I then painted it flash red to match the car. The bracket attaches 
to the front of the filter and mounts on the rear bolt for the radiator 
support. It looks waaay better than the tuners, plus it's one of a kind. 
I take pride in my car and the components I put on it. Anyone can bolt 
parts on that someone else makes. But it's really cool when your at the 
shows, to have people ask you, who makes that neat filter? 

But hey, to each his own. If you feel it's neccesary to spend $120 for a 
filter, go right ahead. I spent the $80 I saved on a front stressbar.

Brian
93 VR6
> 
>  >I'll post this again even though you've probably seen it. You can make 
>  >your own performance filter for both VR6s and G60s. K&N part no. RE0810 
>  >fits excellent and costs about $47 ( VR6 ). For G60s I've seen people at 
>  >shows useing the the Mustang filter from K&N, not sure what the part no. 
>  >is. Make a pretty bracket yourself.
> 
>  >Brian A. Jowett
>  >93 VR6
> 
> Since I don't have access to a machine shop, I wanted to have the fixup place
> make a bracket for me. It turns out that it would cost about 40-50 bucks to 
> make one, so there would be little to no savings. I though, going cheap on my
> Corrado would really bother my conscience. People, we did not buy a Corrado to
> save money.
> 
> 
> Lawrence Wu
> LWU2@CSUpomona.edu
> 
> Black/Black Corrado SLC
> "...racers are like Congressmen. They
> wake up, first thing they say is 'How
> can I get more power today?'"
> 
> 

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Jun 14 15:13 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 14 Jun 95 14:20:41 TZ
From: Scott Stiles 
Subject: More P-Flo
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What I really think the "ideal" P-Flo installation is missing is a
shield/funnel that would serve 2 purposes:

1) direct the cold air from the cold-air inlet (rear of the
headlamp assy.) towards the filter
2) shield the filter from the hot-air surrounding the engine
it might not protect it completely from convected heat
but it would protect it from radiant.

I think the major drawback to the P-Flo is the cold-air
issue, if someone on the list (more motivated than me)
could hack together a shield it would be pretty
marketable me thinks.

I've mocked up something really basic with cardboard, I
would think you could do it with a single piece of galv.
sheet metal (or stainless).  My dad suggested using
a cookie sheet, not a bad idea...
Basically, it's just a sheet with a bend at the right point
to shield both the side and the top of the filter.

Scott.
scottst@microsoft.com
93 VR6
95 Cabrio (I'm not paying for it, thank god)

| >         I put the Neuspeed P-Flo on my car this past Friday and 
have enjoyed
| > lighting up the throttle through the tunnels on I-64 in East Louisville.
| > Man that sound is loud.  Pure joy.  This is what I miss from my 4cyl
| > VWs....they sounded like race cars....now my VR6 does too.  This has
| > prompted my friend to think twice about leaving his G60 stock.     The
| > growling wail is just music, but yet if you dont throttle hard, the car
| > sounds 90% the same as it did before. The car is wild when you want it to
| > be, but civil when you need it to be.
| >



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Jun 20 20:10 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 20 Jun 1995 22:59:34 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: VR6 Mass Airflow Sensor Mods
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I removed the screens from my MAS today. The car is louder, might be 
quiker even. I did not time the runs. Jan, would you care to do some?

Instuctions for removing - Remove MAS from car, Remove large C clips that 
hold the screens in place, remove screens, put MAS back in car. Easy. Not 
permanent. Oh yeah, the cooling fins are there, I'm leaving them alone.

Brian 93 VR6

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Jun 21 09:37 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 21 Jun 1995 12:10:58 -0400
From: TurboTim@aol.com
Subject: Re: VR6 Turbo is on the way
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In a message dated 95-06-20 23:10:58 EDT, you write:

>Just recieved info from Tim on the VR6 turbo. Without the intercooler
>you 
>get 248hp, and 280lbft of tourqe at 3000RPM.

It is also at 6 psi so we know what we can do with an intercooler and 10 psi.
YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

**TT**

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Jun 28 01:20 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 28 Jun 1995 01:11:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lawrence Wu 
Subject: Re: P-FLO kit
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Date sent: 28-JUN-1995 

 >>I installed the P-FLO filter kit last Friday from APS.  It probably did give
 >>me at least 5 more hp or one big reason.  As in this months European Car, the 
 >>screen on the air intake to the filter box was clogged with leaves and one
 >>huge moth.  I've got 40K on the car.  They suggested to remove the prefilter
 >>screen.  I agree.  You'll still have a big filter there that if a big bug lands
 >>on it won't change the filter surface area as much as on the screen.
 >>
 >>As for the K&N, it is nice.  Is the bracket worth 50 bucks.  Well it made 
 >>installation in 20 minutes a snap, and it is good quality and not sheet metal
 >>like I would have made.

 >How do you like the sound of the P-FLO.. I'm also thinking about adding one,
 >but am
 >concerned that it's overly loud and would get annoying after a while..

You can only hear it when you are past half throttle. It's not annoying, since
it's only when the engine is being pushed, plus it sounds so damn fine.

Rode in a Ferrari Dino today, and then  thought to myself, "It doesn't sound
any more musical than the VR6 with the K&N." 

I like the construction of the Neuspeed bracket, but if you want to save some
money, and get the large K&N (I swapped the Neuspeed one for this one) or the
regualr one, call Gilbert at The Place. They make the brackets too. I think he 
said he'd sell the whole set for around $85, if I recall right, but calling 
him would probably be the most accurate way of getting the info. Their number 
is (818)966-4888
....Now back to the show...

Lawrence Wu
LWU2@CSUpomona.edu

Black/Black Corrado SLC
"...racers are like Congressmen. They
wake up, first thing they say is 'How
can I get more power today?'"


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Jul  7 15:48 PDT 1995
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Date: Fri, 07 Jul 1995 18:32:55 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: Cams
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I also posted some questions on VR6 cams earlier on but here's the extent of
my knowledge on this subject: 

Cams with a wilder profile are indeed the next logical choices after the
standard Neuspeed mods, since the VSR intake manifold is rather pricey, and
engine bore & stroke, or cylinder head port & polish, are pretty radical and
costly stuff.
Also, the Corrado's stock exhaust system is so good that most attempts to
improve it by going to larger diameter pipes actually result in power loses
at the lower rpms,
though Eurosport & Autotech's exhaust systems will net you 5 to 7 hp, at the
expense of more noise, which some people might like!

Anyway, I digress. Schrick cams? Good stuff!  Schrick has a strong reputation
in Germany and also do grinds for prepped BMWs, etc.    I've talked to a
couple of people with the 260 Schricks in their Corrados, they were generally
very happy with their choices, reported an extra boost of 10 hp or so above
4000 rpm and a well-behaved idle, coupled with a menacing growl when the
engine comes on cam.  The 268 should give you even more peak power higher up,
the downside being a slightly rougher idle...

ABT's 268?  They are one of the most repected German tuners so I'm sure the
cam's of the highest quality.  It's also lighter and cheaper than the
Schrick...  However, the cams are not manufactured by ABT, but by Sugo (may
not be the correct spelling), and I've been warned about the Sugo cams having
rigidity problems due to their hollow construction. Also this cam is
configured ideally for ABT's 3.0 Litre engine conversion, not for a stock
2.8L VR6... 

P.S. Ron's Parts are the official Schrick importers but you can also get them
from APS, VW Specialties, European Import Performance, AMS, Autotech, etc.

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sat Jul  8 22:59 PDT 1995
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Date: Sun, 09 Jul 1995 01:51:35 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: Air intake improvements?
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Just wanted to pass on some comments from AOL's Corrado message board re this
topic:

******************************************************************************
**********
From:  Swede6969

I constructed a air intake for my 91 CRX si once and it made a noticeable
differance in preformance. What I did was I bought the tubing for air
conditioning for homes. I attached it to the original air intake housing and
pulled it so it was under the front spoiler, ram air i guess. It worked for
me and I bet if you put a little more time and effort in the results would be
even greater. Just an idea I thought i'd share with you guys.

******************************************************************************
**********
From:  SizzerHand

Actually, UNIQUEVR6, in one of the VW FAQs there is discussion about a fellow
who has done just what you are asking about to his Jetta GLX - apparently the
VR6 works better with COLD air anyway, and while the P-Flow is quick and
dirty, and reduces airflow restriction, it's not as good as it COULD be if
you could get COLD air to the car.  They just updated the FAQs, and they're
also on the WEB - have you gotten the WEB for AOL and gotten to rec.autos.vw
in the newsgroups?

******************************************************************************
**********


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sat Jul  8 22:48 PDT 1995
Date: Sun, 09 Jul 1995 01:39:29 -0400
From: HAPPIG@aol.com
Subject: Re: whistling noise when accelerating
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wilfred@io.org Wrte:
>Hi I have a 1994 Corrado VR6, and right now it has 8000Km. I have this funny
>whistling noise whenever I accelerate from 2000 rpm to 3000 rpm. The sound

Well, almost every VR6 that have a P-Flo experience this whistling.  It's
from the air rushing through the air mass flow meter or the throttle body.
 It's like blowing air on an empty bottle neck and you get this whoooo
whistling.  Well, it's something like that.  The whistling occurs only when
the throttle is partially open (slowly accelerating).  At least that's what
heppens with my P-Flo.  If you slam on the gas, the whistling will go away.
 So, if what I mentioned is true, then I won't worry about it.

Hope I helped!
Happig@aol.com

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Jul 13 19:26 PDT 1995
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 1995 22:12:56 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: 3.1 Litre & other VR6 gossip
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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   Someone up in Canada has already done a "3.1" Litre conversion on his VR6
(a Passat GLX) - apparently it has all the goodies:   ABT crank & 82.5mm
forged pistons, VSR, 280 cams, modified chip (programmed by AMS), ported &
polished head with 3 angle valve job, Supersprint headers, Remus exhaust tip,
throttle body, P-Flo, etc, etc.  Hasn't been dynoed yet but EC is going to do
an article on it, I believe.  I've called him a couple of times but he wasn't
in so I don't know the exact details, but sounds like he's got a really great
( and expensive!) setup!

  Other gossip (Disclaimer: these are rumours, not necessarily true or
accurate! Some of this info are quite a few months old, I've just been too
lazy to post them earlier):

   Darrell from Techtonics has all the mods in for his exhaustive lab/dyno
testing (VSR, cams, etc) but it's going to take a while before we hear
anything - am looking forward to seeing some relatively objective
measurements of what the various mods out on the market can really offer us!
 He's also working on a ported/polished cylinder head, about $2000 on an
exchange basis.

  Speaking of heads, a number of shops are also offering prepared VR6 heads
on an exchange basis, including GTA of Quebec (4 angle 50/50 job) and EIP of
Maryland (bigger intake valves).

   You've all heard about ND of Santa Clara's exciting oil cooler kit (sounds
simpler to install than the Neuspeed ones, about $360) and the 11.5" brake
kit (Ferrodo pads? May be rather pricey initially?) from our TurboTim here,
but did you know that ND are finishing tests on their (2.25"?) exhaust system
which features Borla mufflers with a dual tip option - makes a nice, deep but
civilized sound and will offer increased performance without sacrificing
anything from the bottom end (should be available by August/September).
  Autotech, EuroSport, ABT, Oetinger and Supersprint also offer exhaust
systems, with one being currently developed by Techtonics.

   Supersprint headers are finally available for the VR6 via Ron's Parts in
Vancouver, but you may have to wait a little while to get hold of yours. I
hear their exhaust system has a fake cat converter look-alike (!). 

   Dana from Autotech in Southern California is working on dual piston
calipers for the VR6 brakes...

   NEVA will be coming out with a Carbon Fibre tie-bar and hood for the
Corrado in addition to their more cosmetic offerings.  They even have a 17"
rim, flywheel and pistons in the works, though I'm not sure if carbon fibre
is the ideal material for these components, especially in street use...but
they do have some good stuff which I hope they'll research and develop for
VWs (Porsche is their main bread and butter market).

   If you want your Corrado to behave a bit more like a domestic drag machine
(as much as a front wheel drive can, anyway) than a top-end Autobahn
wundercruiser, have you considered replacing your ring and pinion with one
from the European 16-valve Corrados?  Of course, a taller 5th gear and Quaife
differential would help balance things out...talk to GTA, Autotech or AMS
about the ring and pinion.

   Well, that's all for now - anyone heard of anything else for the Corrado
or VR6?  Please tell me that the prototypical 24-valve head is finally
available or that a reliable turbo VR6 is being put together...;-)

UniqueVR6

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Jul 13 19:24 PDT 1995
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 1995 22:12:51 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: VR6 throttle body
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Nick, I also talked to Velocity a while ago about boring out the throttle
body (the Neuspeed one, not the stock), they said that would leave the walls
too thin so they decided instead to make up a different, bigger one slated
for production around September.  Don't know if this bigger volume throttle
body will have that much of an effect on a stock VR6 except at high rpms (may
even reduce some power lower down...), but should complement any bigger
displacement conversions nicely!

BTW, Extrudehone told me that they do not do any work on throttle bodies and
did not recommend extrude honing the VSR because of the flap between the 2
runners... 

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Jul 13 12:40 PDT 1995
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 1995 12:33:41 -0700
From: NSnyder@sugar-land.dowell.slb.com (Nick Snyder)
Subject: VR6 throttle body
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
X-Sender: NSnyder@dsnvsg.sugar-land.dowell.slb.com
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I called Velocity today about the T-body they are making for the VR6...it
will be bigger than
the typical European ones that are on the market from the other tuners.  It
will be out at the
end of summer for around $370.00 or so.  It's supposed to be about 68-74mm
(i think that's what he said)
Anyway if any of you are interested call Velocity (310-643-0005) and tell
them you want to be put on
the list of VR6 owners, and they will notify you when it's completed.  I
don't want to risk messing mine
up by trying to modify it myself.

 NSnyder@sugar-land.dowell.slb.com
          >>93 Corrado SLC<<
 "Porsche performance at a VW price"


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Jul 12 18:23 PDT 1995
Date: Wed, 12 Jul 1995 17:16:46 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gary Andrew Yuen 
Subject: Re: VR6 throttle body
In-Reply-To: <01HSSFH8DYGY001KQB@UG.EDS.COM>
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: Jan Vandenbrande 
Cc: corrado-l@teleport.com
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On Wed, 12 Jul 1995, Jan Vandenbrande wrote:

> > On Wed, 12 Jul 1995, Kenneth Finnegan wrote:
> > 
> > > >In a message dated 95-07-11 20:08:30 EDT, you write:
> > > Abrasive flow porting (whereby abrasive material with the consistency
> > > of silly putty is forced through the passages) seems to be the current
> > > pinnacle of porting technology in terms of both effectiveness and
> > > cost.
> > 
> >      Is it easy to do that yourself?  I've heard Extrude Hone on the VR6 
> > intake manifold gives about the same results as a VSR for less than half 
> > the price.  If it could be a DIY thing, then I'm there.
> 
> I actually looked into ExtrudeHone, and if you have actual data for
> a VR6, not for a Camaro or a Mustang, I'd like to get a copy.
> ExtrudeHone is not something you do your self. They use high powered
> pumps to press abrasive putty through your manifold.
> For a VR6 manifold it costs between 800-1000US$. Not cheap.

       The only person I've talked to so far is a guy a Motronix 
Motorsports in Canada.  He says 20hp and 17 ft-lbs of torque.  He said it 
was about $1000 plus about $200 for the fuel enrichment kit that he 
recommends for the job.  He would be the best place to look for info, or 
maybe Extrude Hone directly.   I think other shops have done it also  (Ed?).

Gary


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Jul 17 19:07 PDT 1995
Date: Mon, 17 Jul 1995 13:42:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jan Vandenbrande 
Subject: Re: Questions on unproven mods...
In-Reply-To: <950716062121_115884775@aol.com>; from "HAPPIG@aol.com" at Jul 16,
 95 6:21 am
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> UniqueVR6 wrote:
> >1)  Is anyone familiar with the "Tornado"? This is a device with fins that

Stuff like this been around for a while...
About 15 years ago they came out with these thimbles drilled with holes
that you would drop between the manifold and the carb. It would
swirl the mixture better.
Some Euro consmumer agency checked it out and said it did nothing at best
and made things worse in the worst case.
Reason is simple...you are creating a slight restriction in your
airstream. 

In carburated cars, where the manifolds are "wet" the swirl may help
fuel evaporation, but in fuel injected cars where you may be several
feet before the combustion chamber and injectors that atomize the
fuel, I cannot see how much good it would do.

>   But the thing that would really improve P-Flo sound and maybe performance
> is an aluminum pipe leading from the throttle body to the mass air flow
> sensor.  My cousin's 91 integra had a K&N conical filter with stock rubber

In the case of the VR6 that may actually help...I was talking to
an old "race car" maker (go karts, Baja, Formula cars, etc)
When he looked at the "harmonica style elbow" between the air mass
sensor and the intake manifold he laughed and commented that I should
start there. He suggested replacing it with a smoothly bent pipe.
One problem is that there are a bunch of other tubes hanging from that
damn thing.

Actually, if you have a look at the VR6 Golfs...that elbow is much
smoother, perhaps because it's cheaper to make but I wonder
if it'll fit and whether it would help power.

Talking of intake manifolds...ever seen one made out of a thermohardend
plastic. The whole thing is injected molded with all additional
stuff molded in. Awesome. No porting or polishing needed!
The surface finish is very good and the whole thing weighs next to
nothing. I immagine the manufacturing costs are less (because several
car makers are getting into it), but I wonder how much
the set up costs are because the machine to make them is very complex.


--
              o   ___|___    [\\]    | Jan Vandenbrande          jan@ug.eds.com
   __0    /\0/   /-------\      _    | "Autoracing, mountain climbing and 
   \<,_  O  \\  (_________)  .#/_\_. |  running of the bulls are sports, the
(_)/ (_)    //  [_]     [_]  |_(_)_| |  rest are mere games", Hemmingway.

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Jul 20 20:52 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 19 Jul 1995 22:35:57 -0400
From: TurboTim@aol.com
Subject: Re: Bigger throttle body
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In a message dated 95-07-19 14:44:24 EDT, you write:

>Just talked to Velocity, looks like they are currently not allocating any
>time into developing a bigger bore throttle body for the VR6 due mostly to a
>perceived lack of demand and a small market!  For those of you who would
like
>an alternative to the Neuspeed option, would definitely help if we were to
>show them that Corrado owners are significant if a minority in the motorcar
>community. If they get enough calls (310-643-0005, Los Angeles) expressing
an
>interest, I believe they will put some time into moving this from the design
>stage into production.

Bigger bore throttle bodies are available from us. We (ND) can get them for
$250 and they are made by ELP. They have not done one yet but will once we
send it to them. The say 3.5mm increase but we do not think thats possible.
Will have to get one sent out to them and see. They did a G-60 one and it
worked quite nice. We did not get a chance to dyno it. We will have to test
the VR6 TB and hope to do it in a while.



**TT**

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Aug  1 08:09 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 01 Aug 1995 10:56:30 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Rod Ratios
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   As I sit here twiddling my fingers and impatiently waiting for the work on
my rebuilt motor to be completed, my mind fell to pondering, how much of an
adverse effect would the reduced rod ratio for this reworked engine have on
its smoothness, redline and reliability? 

  Let's see, the super long rods in the VR6 are supposedly one of the main
reasons why this narrow angle vee engine is so smooth, free-reving, durable
and clean in the emissions department.  

  According to James Sly's Jan 1995 article in EC, "Rod ratio = Connecting
rod length / Crankshaft stroke", where 1.65 is considered by many engine
builders to be the minimum desirable figure. 

1)  Stock     VR6:   Rod ratio = 1.8  (164 mm / 90.3 mm)
2)  Modified VR6:   Rod ratio = 1.7  (164 mm / 96.5 mm)

 As illustrated above, increasing the stroke another 6.2 mm as per the ABT
crankshaft kit would decrease the rod ratio since the stock rods remain the
same length of 164 mm.  This should increase torque and low end grunt, as
expected, but may it also increase emissions & piston wear, and reduce top
end revs & smoothness?   

Edward
UniqueVR6

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Aug  2 16:01 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 02 Aug 1995 16:26:21 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: 3.1 Litre VR6 update #1
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   Hello, people, for those of you who have expressed an interest in the
status of my ongoing 3.1 Litre project, preliminary flowbench results have
come in and I'm rather excited, so just had to share the following with you!
 

   The 106 cfm figures I posted in an earlier message are probably not
completely accurate, but what I can reveal to you folks before anyone else
(i.e. European Car) is that my new head with the 42 mm intake valves (stock
ones are about 39.4 mm), modified intake manifold and a pair of Schrick 268
cams has a * 40% * increase in airflow over the stock VR6 head with stock
cams & manifold...

   Of course we won't really know what this all means until the work on
engine is completed and it is dynoed/driven, but I'm confident that we are
(conservatively) talking about at least 240 hp for the final engine output,
with a much broader torque curve than stock!

   EIP started boring the block this week, and the assembly/balancing will
take place after that. My only regret is that I don't personally get to see
all the new parts and their installation (just the $$$ appearing on my credit
card statements!) since we are doing a coast-to-coast engine swap.

   Since my baby's the guinea pig for this project, most of the major kinks
should be ironed out by the time any of you feel like embarking on something
similar or exploring even more radical avenues...I'll try to share what we
learn from this first attempt at exploiting more fully the amazing potential
of the VR6  with those of you who are interested!

Cheers,    :o)
Edward
"UniqueVR6@aol.com"

P.S.  One of my goals for this project was to elevate SOME parameters of our
beloved Corrado's performance to Porsche 911 (non-turbo) or BMW M3 levels for
a VW-level price...

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sat Aug 12 09:42 PDT 1995
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Date: Sat, 12 Aug 1995 12:34:53 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: * Dyno Results *
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  Just got my car back with the ND oil cooler installed.  Cool! (literally as
well as figuratively).   Look out for an EC tech procedure article with
photos on this soon if you prefer to install it yourself (there's less room
on a VR6 but should be more straightforward than the Neuspeed version).  Will
post results later, but initial observations is that the oil temp now runs at
least 10 to 18 degrees lower, with the biggest differences occuring when the
engine is being flogged hard and the vehicle's moving at some speed...

   Oh, here are the preliminary results from the ND dyno.  Haven't analysed
them properly yet, but looks like the factory airbox with a K&N filter
element makes at least as much power (actually a bit more at the low and mid
end!) as the P-flo and peaks at around 5500 rpm, but the P-flo has the
advantage higher up as it keeps going past redline.  These observations of
course apply to a Corrado VR6 with the P-chip and Neuspeed throttle body
already installed...
   This correlates in general with my subjective personal driving experience
- the car felt slightly less sluggish in the lower middle rpms with the K&N
in the airbox (better velocity, lower air temperatures?), but seem to open up
more eagerly around, and beyond, redline with the P-flo (better
breathing?)...

   Assuming a conservative formula of Engine hp = Wheel hp * 1.25, then we
expect to see at least 200bhp for the P-Flo, P-chip & throttle body
combination.  If Torque = Engine hp x 5252 / rpm, then we're getting around
205 lbs/ft at 4500 rpm.

   Interestingly enough, ND's exhaust system on a stock VR6 GTI comes close
to these figures for the Neuspeed mods.  I wonder what the ND exhaust and
Neuspeed combination would do for the VR6?!   Comments, Tim?

   As for the other dyno figures, looks like the K&N filter element delivers
more hp than the Amsoil in the top end.  Also the Tornado device didn't seem
to have made much of a difference either way.  On a slightly negative note, I
called the Tornado people after the dyno results to request a refund (they
supposedly have a 30 day money back guarantee), but they gave me a hard time
saying such things as "Dyno figures don't mean anything because the car is
not moving" (uh, didn't they themselves use dyno figures to "prove" their
product's effectiveness in their ads?) and "well, we have thousands of very
happy customers and the magazines rate the Tornado as being the best" (hmm,
just because some people like it doesn't mean I have to like it also,
especially if my tests & experience with hp & mpg doesn't support your
impressive claims)...

Edward

***************************************************************************
1992 Corrado VR6, w/Neuspeed P-Chip and Throttle body
(No changes in the Corrado for both dyno runs except for ND oil cooler for
8/10 and as noted below):
Ambient Temp:  74-80 F (8/10/95)   Not recorded for 6/27 (cooler?)
Humidity:          77%  (8/10/95)       Not recorded for 6/27
Date of Dyno:   8/10/95 (K&N, Amsoil, Tornado),      6/27/94 (P-flo)   
Location   :       New Dimensions

RPM      HP      HP         HP               HP
            P-Flo   K&N     Amsoil   Amsoil + Tornado
------     -----     ------    --------   ----------------------
3,000    81.0     83.1       83.0      83.0
3,500    99.0    103.0     101.5    102.1
4,000   123.3   122.1     124.8    122.5  
4,500   138.9   140.3     139.2    139.0
5,000   148.3   152.5     151.1    151.0 
5,500   155.0   159.2     156.4    156.3  
6,000   156.1   158.0     156.7    156.0
6,500   160.7     n/a        n/a      140.0

***************************************************************************


From UniqueVR6@aol.com Tue Aug 15 11:48 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 14:40:46 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: * Dyno Results * (addendum)
To: jan@UG.EDS.COM, corrado-l@teleport.com
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> I am sure your note has already made it into the hands
>of Aaron, Mark and Dana, and they are ready to shoot you at the
>next opportunity they have.  :->

   Can't wait to be shot down! Actually I'd be quite honoured should these VW
tuner giants pay attention to someone ordinary like me  ;o)    As an addendum
to my * Dyno Results * post, may I add that some caution should be exercised
in their interpretation, and that we should be aware of the following:

1)     Since there is often a significant variation in engine output between
cars of the same model, these test results should be interpretated as an
INDICATION only of the RELATIVE effects of the Neuspeed P-Flow vs the Factory
Airbox with a high-flow filter, on a Neuspeed throttle body & P-Chip equipped
1992 Corrado VR6 under those test conditions.  No dyno measurements had been
taken of the same test car in a stock state BEFORE any of these Neuspeed
modifications were installed.

2)    The factory airbox was not in a completely stock condition for the K&N
and Amsoil tests since I had  removed the snorkel located in the lower front
(the one with the mesh screen filter) to improve flow.  We do not have any
results here for the Neuspeed P-chip and throttle body combination with a
completely stock factory airbox & stock filter.

3)    Both dyno runs were made with the same equipment (as far as I am aware
of) and at the same physical location. There were no additional modifications
to the engine between 6/27/94 and 8/10/95, other than the ND oil cooler kit
being installed before the 8/10/95 session.  This in itself may have had some
impact on the readings.  In addition, other parameters such as the engine
breaking in (about 13000 miles on 6/27 and 26000 on 8/10), differences in
petrol/gas and oil quality, spark plug conditions, etc may have affected the
measurements somewhat?


4)    The ambient temp and humidity were not recorded for the 6/27/94 dyno
with the P-Flow, P-chip, throttle body.  All I remember is that the run was
initiated at about 6:30pm, and that it was a dry and fairly mild day.

5)    We look forward to Darrell's dyno results from testing the plethora of
VR6 performance enhancements currently available. Perhaps his extensive
research will pick up pace if enough of us VR6 enthusiasts will let
Techtonics know that there is a significant number of people out there who
would be very interested in seeing these results...

Edward 
UniqueVR6@aol.com

From UniqueVR6@aol.com Tue Aug 15 18:48 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 21:45:02 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: * Dyno Results * (2nd addendum)
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Jan, another thing to note is that it's pretty obvious the K&N filter does
better in the horsepower department than the Amsoil above 5000 rpm, according
to the results.  What these dyno figures don't show however, is that the K&N
might also let more dirt in than the Amsoil...

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Aug 16 17:35 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 16 Aug 1995 20:21:56 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Bigger VR6 throttle body
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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   Guess people from this list must have been calling Velocity Sport Tuning
in southern California - Jeff told me that up to 2 to 3 weeks ago, there have
only been a few inquiries re VR6 mods and so they have not given it much
priority.  However, because of a recent increase in demand/interest, they
will be testing a larger VR6 throttle body with a bigger throat & plate (i.e.
not just boring out the stock or Neuspeed one) by the end of the month, size
will be from anywhere from 64mm to 70mm (stock is 64mm). 

   If test results look good (i.e. low end is not compromised), they will be
able to sell an unit sometime in September.  The downside is that estimated
cost is a whopping $400-450!   Any news re the ELP version, Tim?

  Velocity also claims to have made up a set of 42mm intake and 35mm exhaust
valves for the VR6 head (stock = 40mm / 33mm?)... 

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Aug 18 01:22 PDT 1995
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Date: Fri, 18 Aug 1995 01:11:28 -0700
From: lwu2@csupomona.edu (Lawrence Wu)
Subject: Canadian front spoiler
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Date sent: 18-AUG-1995 



Anyone know if the Canadian Corrados have the European spoilers (the bigger
ones), or the US ones? I'm going up to Canada really soon, so I may pick one up
there.

BTW I just tried the APE chip and I really like it. It makes the engine run
smoother and the car more drivable. No pings at all.


Lawrence Wu
LWU2@CSUpomona.edu
Black/Black Corrado SLC

"Quicker than a beaver, hotter than a fever"

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Aug 21 12:44 PDT 1995
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Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:07:02 -0400
From: TurboTim@aol.com
Subject: Re: VR6 exhaust
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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In a message dated 95-08-19 01:09:06 EDT, you write:

>I was wondering if anyone with the VR6 has changed their exhaust system? I
>remember Aaron at Neuspeed telling me that there would be no benefit, since 
>the stock exhaust is free flowing and has a good diameter piping already.
>What
>have your experiences been?
>
>

Aaron will be testing one of our systems soon as we have them ready to ship.
We have been test fitting the twin tips for the GLX and just got started on
the G-60. Will keep you posted on results. Listed below are results from our
GTI VR6 system.

A3 Golf GTI  VR6 bone stock

                     stock                    with ND exhaust only
         numbers are wheel hp
3000                77.6                                    81.3
                   for engine hp x1.25
3500                95.7                                   100.0
4000               118.6                                   119.6
4500               131.8                                   137.9
5000               140.6                                   146.4
5500               144.2                                   153.5
6000               142.6                                   157.2

**TT**

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Aug 21 22:20 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 01:14:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Salvage yard oil cooler
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Well here's another one my money saving ideas. Early Saab 900 Turbos have 
a factory add-on oil cooler that may be adaptable to our VWs. I got one 
off of a friends parts car. Interestingly, it looks almost exactly like 
the oil coolers pictured in NDs catalog. The adaptor looks exact, and the 
cooler looks like the Mocal thats pictured also.

It looks as though for now, the stock oil to water cooler would have to 
be removed for its installation. I have bolted the adaptor in place on an 
8V motor I have sitting in my garage, so it will fit G60s, and since the 
VR6 uses the same stock cooler, I don't see a problem with bolting it in 
place on it.

Now I Know it sounds silly ( and posibly disastrous ) to be installing 
used oil cooler parts, but they are off of a Saab. Saabs are well built, 
and I doubt very much that they would be useing second rate parts on a 
Turbo motor. I called the local dealer and i can purchae new hoses and a 
T-stat for about $50. That should eliminate any worry in my head.

Tim are there any identifying marks i may be able to find on these 
pieces so that I may fin out who made them? Also, the cooler measures 4 
3/4 by 6 1/2, is it big enough to do the job?

Brian 93 VR6

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sun Aug 27 02:27 PDT 1995
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Date: Sun, 27 Aug 1995 04:34:36 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: *3.1 litre twin-turbo VR6*
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   Just chatted with Richie - for those of you who missed an earlier post of
mine, this is the VW enthusiast up in Canada who's done things to his VR6
that would make my 3.1 project car look like a dinky econo-car in comparison!
  For example:

1)  First, Rich started with the Neuspeed mods (P-flo, throttle body, P-chip)
and suspension stuff.  Some improvements over stock but nothing to write home
about.  
2)  He next added a pair of Schrick 260 cams.  Not bad especially higher up
in the powerband but somehow something was still missing... 
3)  Then Rich popped in the VSR manifold and Schrick 268...WOW, now we're
talking!  Instant useful power coming on around 3000rpm, and a soul-stirring
roar as the VSR butterfly flap spins open @ 4000rpm!   He commented that this
combination was quite an eye-opener in terms of real-world performance gains.
4)  Now, just for fun, let's drop in that 3.1 litre bored and stroked
engine...  Whilst we're about it, why not port n' polish the Neuspeed
throttle body & cylinder head, match-porting the intake & exhaust.  Hmm, how
about replacing the factory exhaust with a Supersprint system complete with
ported headers and free-flowing mufflers  To harness all that power, let's
add a Quaife differential, lightened flywheel, Sachs Sports clutch and
heavy-duty pressure plate.  Now, don't forget those *dual-piston* caliper
brakes, and 17" rims with the 215/40ZR17 super rubber to tame that "VR6
engine on steroids".  And of course a special order to Aaron for a
custom-programmed Neuspeed chip for the whole system!   The party's about to
begin...talk about gobs of creamy smooth power from the lower midrange up,
yet free-reving to 7000rpm and beyond...pretty sick, eh? (I'm drooling
already at the thought, even though I haven't sat in Rich's car - yet!)
5)  Wait, that's just for starters, the best part's yet to come - in addition
to Schrick heavy-duty valve springs, VW Motorsport steel synchro rings and
other esoteric goodies, Rich is already working with Ron's Parts on a *16 psi
twin-turbo* 3.1 VR6 (possibly incorporating a Garrett T03 turbocharger) which
will use shorter Carillo connecting rods to reduce the compression ratio, and
is at the same time keeping an eye on the 24-valve prototype VR6 head which
VW announced and displayed 2 weeks ago!  This 3.1 twin-turbo terror is slated
to humiliate the competition by the end of the year, if the engine doesn't
blow up (yes, the 16 psi estimate was NOT a misprint) before then!

   Well, fellow enthusiasts, looks like Rich is rather serious about VR6
performance, which is really smashing!  Even if most of us can not afford to
do even 10% of what he's put in his project car, it's super just dreaming and
seeing how far up on the performance ladder one could elevate the VR6 to!   I
also mentioned the Corrado group to Rich, and he's definitely interested in
coming down to California sometime to talk shop with us and let us take a
look/ride (and dare I hope, drive?) in his super VR6!

   Anyway, as you can see, my enthusiasm was indeed sparked and so I had to
rush-email this before I came down to earth. So, please excuse any sloppy
writing or inaccuracies on my part, it's 1:35 am but I just had to share this
with all of you...

Cheers,
Edward
UniqueVR6

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sun Aug 27 11:41 PDT 1995
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Date: Sun, 27 Aug 1995 14:34:49 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: *3.1 litre twin-turbo VR6*
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   An addendum to my 3.1 litre VR6 post:

   Richie is currently running Goodyear GS-D P225/35ZR17s, not P215/40-17s as
I had previously reported.  He admits that this combination was put together
more for cosmetic reasons (pencil-thin band of rubber) than for pure
performance since the Goodyears give decent but not ultimate performance in
terms of grip.  Interestingly enough, he runs 15" on the track, but switches
back to the 17" on the street.

   Also his Passat GLX 3.1 litre setup has not been dynoed as yet - 300bhp
figures have been loosely quoted for his engine, but Rich is a little
skeptical of such claims.  He does strongly recommend the 3.1 litre
conversion, if one could afford it, as the real-world performance gains in
acceleration throughout most of the powerband are quite significant!  Also he
reports that there has been absolutely no problems in terms of reliability so
far even though he regularly pushes his VR6 extremely hard, on both the track
and street (I believe he's claimed to have hit the mid 150mph speeds).  And
the engine is getting stronger each day as it breaks in more...

Edward

P.S.  In case any of you have a problem with some of my writing, I apologise!
 I grew up in the UK but have lived in the States longer so am not too
consistent sometimes (i.e. usage of American slang coupled with English
spellings) - please bear with me!
  

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Aug 28 14:10 PDT 1995
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Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 16:58:02 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: VSR tidbits
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   Some German tuner's supposed to be coming out with their (hopefully
cheaper and equally effective) version of the VSR very soon, haven't heard
anything more re the Brazilian VSR.

   According to Aaron (Neuspeed), one of the reasons for the VSR's impressive
performance gains is VW Motorsport's programming of their ECU - the chip has
aggressive timing programmed in the middle rev range, and the rev limiter is
set at 7600-7700 rpm!  In comparison, the P-chip extends the rev limit to
7500 rpm from the factory 7000 rpm mark...

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Aug 29 09:11 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 29 Aug 1995 12:02:16 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Bigger throttle body
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   Velocity has started tests on their bigger throttle body prototype.
 Initial tooling costs are high, but if the mod can net a gain of 5 hp or
more up top on a stock VR6 without losing more than 2 hp or so at the low
end, they will bring it to market.   

   GTA has also started research on something similar.  Their version will
probably use a butterfly plate that's 4mm larger than the European one.  The
main obstacle involves a clean cutting of the brass plate without causing
warping, maybe high-tech tools such as lasers are required!  ;-) 

   Also waiting for ND to get the ELP one in for dyno testing.  In addition,
quite a few other tuners are offering less radical solutions like a slight
boring out of the US or Neuspeed throttle body.  Including a few people on
the list with a more cost-effective, do-it-yourself approach like our very
own Brian here, I believe...

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Aug 29 09:11 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 29 Aug 1995 11:58:14 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: *3.1 litre VR6*
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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    For those of you who are somewhat obsessive about tweaking things and do
not like leaving a well-designed thing alone (i.e. me), looks like the 3.1
litre conversion is becoming more popular with each passing day on the
American continent!  

    GTA just delivered to a Jetta GLX customer in Mexico a rebuilt engine
with the ABT bigger bore/longer stroke 3.1 kit. This had a ported and
polished head, Abt (Suko) hollow 268 cams with press-fit lobes, Abt
re-programmed ECU, Abt headers.  The European throttle body was used, and the
inlet manifold remained stock.   Another customer of Louis will be doing a
3.0 litre (Abt crankshaft) conversion soon.  Two other people on the east
coast have put down the money for a 3.1 too.

    Anyone on the list contemplating going in this direction?  Anyone won the
lottery lately?  ;o)

    Oh, I've heard rumours that Ron's Parts is tinkering with the idea of
popping a 3.1 VR6 into a rabbit.  Yes, a rabbit!!  Just think of power to
weight ratio!!!  My only concern would be how the older chassis would cope
with all this power and how stable/reliable everything would be at 150 mph?!
 Interesting concept, though.

Cheers,
Edward

P.S.  Hey, I'd better get back to work...I've been spending much more time
than I really should hanging out on this list!  It's just been really
educational and fun reading all the posts here on so many diverse topics, you
chaps have so much to offer from mundane everyday maintenance tips to exotic
outrageously priced conversions...I've really enjoyed being part of this
Corrado list/club!   Very knowledgeable and wonderfully supportive group of
enthusiasts...   I think I've seen less juvenile flaming and personal attacks
here than on all the other message boards. Which is a very good thing for me,
since I tend to get over-excited sometimes with some of the ground-breaking
news and as a result make impulsive statements/claims without verifying them
first!  Well, guess I'm just learning, being new to motorcar mechanics and
all of that stuff...  :)

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Aug 28 22:04 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 29 Aug 1995 01:00:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Re: *3.1 litre twin-turbo VR6* costs
In-Reply-To: <950828165759_85475008@mail06.mail.aol.com>
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It's not to much work.  Maybe an hour total. It's not hollow, but there 
is a dimple. However, the ramp is thick enough to grind quite alot away 
without going through. There are roller type bearings in there, but since 
I'm not welding, No worries. I took mine apart and painted it so people 
would know that it aint stock. You can do this without messing up the 
potentiometer by mesuring its resistance with a digital multimeter ( 
Fluke meter ) so it can be put back to the stock setting. I would like to 
dyno it.

Brian 93 VR6> 
>     Brian, I guess you did the porting job yourself since it didn't cost
> anything...was it a lot of work?  I believe that the stock throttle body is
> hollow around that restrictive lip/ramp area, if so, did you have to use
> epoxy or something since there are seals on the bearings that may be
> heat-sensitive (i.e. not weldable)?  Any dyno or timing runs after you did
> this?  Please excuse any redundant or repeated questions, I seem to recall
> that there were some posts regarding this subject a while back, but I don't
> remember the exact context...
> 
> Edward
> 

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Aug 30 15:55 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 30 Aug 1995 18:45:37 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Preliminary Unofficial Cam Dyno Results
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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   Darrell (Techtonics) is currently in the midst of his suite of tests on
VR6 performance parts, and here are some preliminary observations:  

   Schrick 260  - about 12hp gain @ 5500rpm (over stock).
   Schrick 268  - unable to set to factory alignment, have to install in
"advanced" or "retarded" position.  Will result in a boost at either the
lower end or at the top end.
   ABT 268 - nice gain at the bottom, but a loss of 30hp at the top!!!
  Something funny going on here...

  Again, I would like to stress that these are totally unofficial preliminary
results, I don't have details of the test environment/context, and so can not
vouch for their accuracy.  In fact, Darrell would probably not be too pleased
that I've "published" them here as he told me that Techtonics won't have any
results available for public consumption for another couple of weeks (I
didn't find out the above from him).  

   Just wanted to share the scoop with you and to let Darrell know that we in
the VR6 community support his efforts at obtaining objective measurements for
these mods.  Just call the above an unsubstantiated rumour, alright?

Your roving reporter,
Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Sep 14 14:35 PDT 1995
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Date: Thu, 14 Sep 1995 14:27:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: rich@amcc.com (Ricardo Higgins)
Subject: Re: SLC torque table (was Re: Optimum Shifting Point for Corrado)
In-Reply-To: <199509072056.QAA05536@hamlet.dev.cdx.mot.com>; from
 "Art Barabell" at Sep 7, 95 4:56 pm
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> 
> In a recent e-mail, a table of torque vs. rpm for various flavors of Corrados
> was reproduced from the archive file "VR6_Power_Upgrades". I don't know about
> the other columns, but the one for a stock SLC seems off. The table shows a
> peak of 197 ft-lbs @ 4500; yet the factory figure is a peak figure of 177
> ft-lbs. I guess we should take heed of the disclaimer which accompanied the
> table "Note that I have no idea on the accuracy (or reliability) of any of
> these measurements."
> 
> Arthur Barabell
> '92 Corrado SLC
> 

Hey,
I found a neat program that will compute optimum shift points, best launch
RPM. The program even has a cool simulated 1/4 race based on several current
vehicle models. You enter or modify your car specs and away it goes. To compute
shift points it does calculations and you see messages like "wheelspin" flash
across the screen.

 If someone wants it I could uuencode it and post it somewhere, or mail it to
someone to put on the webpage.

 Ric
 '69 912
 '72 Ghia
 '95 Jetta GLX  

 This program could be used to figure optimum shift points for both modified and
unmodified Corrados.

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Sep 14 20:23 PDT 1995
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Date: Thu, 14 Sep 1995 23:16:07 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: VR6 *rumours*
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   Heard that VW decided against a turbo VR6 after their experience with the
one-off turbo Sharan that Porsche did for them (280bhp) - apparently they
experienced some major overheating probems...  However, the forced induction
VR6 built in Florida appears to be running fine, Ron's Parts and Motronix are
plowing ahead with their respective turbo VR6 projects, and ND will be
working on theirs at some future point.  Approaches to lowering the
compression ratio range from head spacers to custom pistons to shorter
connecting rods.

   I mentioned a while ago about the 24-valve VR6 cylinder head prototype VW
was playing around with, looks like it won't ever go into production due to
cost considerations.  Boohoo.  Also depressing rumours have been circulating
of the VR6 being eventually phased out and replaced by a VR5...come on, VW,
first you killed the Corrado, and now the VR6???   Hopefully this is only
gossip and not reality...

   Bigger displacement VR6s seem to be surfacing everywhere.  To mention just
a few, a 3.1 litre GTI is being done in PA with custom titanium connecting
rods ($2300 for just the rods + balancing!) and possibly a Techtonics head:
 a Jetta GLX 3.1 was done by GTA in Canada and is now flexing its muscles in
Mexico:  Ron's Parts may be selling the really souped-up 3.1 they recently
installed in a Passat GLX as the customer wants to move on to a twin-turbo
3.1 crafted from a fresh block (RPI also popped a VR6 into a *Rabbit*, just
for fun!):  AMS has just completed a 3.0 VR6 GTI and will be working on a 3.0
Corrado.  Oh, not to forget my own 3.1 being put together by EIP... anyone
heard of any other conversions?

Cheers,
Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Sep 18 02:10 PDT 1995
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Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 04:58:31 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: upgrades (Part 2)
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  Hmm, looks like America On-Line's internet gateway's acting up again!  I've
posted several messages to the list last week which either never showed up,
or appeared to everyone on the list except for me, or had the body text cut
off...

Anyway, here's the portion that were deleted from my response to Butch's
questions on performance upgrades to his Corrado VR6...yawn, now I can
finally retire to bed...
********************************************
>Anyone in favor of 
>those $250 computer chips?  If so, which one is best.
   I'm currently using the APS (Neuspeed) chip on my 92 VR6.  Biggest
difference is the full-throttle response. The speed limiter has also been
removed, and the rev limit raised another 500rpm or so. Expect a gain from 7
to 12 hp, depending on what other mods you have installed. The Neuspeed chip
seems to be the most popular, but Autothority has its loyal following too.
 The AMS version is probably one of the best custom programmed ones currently
available, though I don't have any personal experience with it.  Dinan,
Superchips which claims an increase of 21 hp (rather optimistic?), and
Star*Chips in the UK also produce performance chips.

>What about a throttle body
   I would consider this only after something like the P-Chip and P-Flow.
 You may decide $369.95 retail is too big a price to pay for a mere 5 hp or
so of power at the top end (at the possible expense of a small power loss at
the low end), or you may look into boring out the restrictive lip yourself.
 Options besides the well-known Neuspeed/European throttle-body include
custom enlarged versions from ELP/ND, Velocity, and European Import...

> Cams...?
   For a stock-like idle and minimal impact on streetability and emissions,
the relatively mild Schrick 260 cams are recommended.  For even more peak
power (but pushed higher up in the powerband), Schrick or ABT 268.  (If you
are racing, Schrick has 276 cams available). Remember, at this point, you are
playing around with $1000+ items... 

   BTW, the ABTs are made by Sugo and have distinctive hollow shafts which
make them lighter and so theoretically better at very high rpms, but this may
be only a theoretical advantage as we may be talking about 8000+ rpm, the
ABTs are lighter only along the axis/centre of rotation and so have less of
an impact, and are probably not as strong as the Schricks?

>really nice but stock exhaust (I 
>noticed several Leistritz stamps throughout).  Is there a better one
>available?
>
   The stock system is hard to beat as VW really did an outstanding job
there.  I've heard the Leistritz Sports muffler advertised by some dealers
are comparable to the factory ones. Avoid some of the cheaper solutions which
replace the rear muffler with a domestic "turbo" version - louder but not
necessarily better!  Another approach commonly taken is to install a
straight-through pipe in place of the mid-muffler, or even the front muffler
(resonator).
   Autotech and Eurosport advertise their own custom exhaust systems, but I
would personally recommend New Dimension's forthcoming model judging by their
dyno test results. Very impressive.  You may look at the Supersprint and ABT
systems too, which should be good but rather pricey...

>I would like to JUMP to 17", but what would that do to the handling?  Will
they
>fit?  What size tires?
>
  I'm going to leave this to my better-informed colleagues as it is a whole
subject matter in itself (also I'm starting to doze off, sorry)...  Check the
archives too.

Good luck in your quest for more performance!
Edward



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Sep 18 01:43 PDT 1995
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Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 04:32:56 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Update on Canadian 3.1 VR6
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   Ritchie (the person in Canada with the 3.1 litre Passat GLX) has already
logged a few thousand miles with his rebuilt engine, reports it's getting
looser with each passing mile, and that the torque just seem to be growing
stronger and stronger.  

   He hopes to dyno his setup in the next week or two, and reports he has
already posted quarter-mile track times in the 14 second bracket and 0-60
times in the low 6 sec area - remember, the Passat is quite a heavy car
especially with the custom mega-stereo system he had installed.

   A little concerned with the torque steer he's getting despite the Quaife
differential, Rich is now toying with the idea of converting his car to a
Syncro version, but that will probably have to wait until the (twin) turbo
3.1 project gets underway in October.
Meanwhile, he can still enjoy the 3.1 and also his G60 Cabriolet...  BTW,
they'll be firing up the *VR6 Rabbit*  up at Ron's Parts today (Monday),
should be rather interesting!

> Now I
>also have put together a massive AP racing brake set-up for most VW's. The
>kit uses 4 piston racing calipers with 12" rotors with optional 2 piston
rear
>calipers
>
   12" rotors, Tim?  Amazing!  Cost of these? (Probably even more amazing!)
 Actually, believe it or not, Rich is currently looking into a set of *13.5"*
calipers for his Passat...

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Sep 21 09:53 PDT 1995
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Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 16:55:36 -0800 (PST)
From: Lawrence Wu 
Subject: Re: G60 Chips??
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Date sent: 18-SEP-1995 
 >Hey,
 >I am going to buy a new chip for my '90 G60 and Iam trying to decide which one.
 >I have narrowed it down to the P-Chip from Nuspeed and the Q-chip from Autotech.
 >Does anybody have a preference? Why? Should I also get the P-Flow or just a
 >K&N element replacement. 

 >Thanks, 
 >CB

Although I have a VR6 instead I'll share my opinion.

I'm really happy with my Autothority chip. I've heard that the Neuspeed ones
are too mild to make any noticable difference, so I got the Autothority one.
Some people wrote about knocking problems, but I haven't experienced anything
like that yet. If anyone has a VR6 and is looking into chips, this is one I'd
recommend looking into.

As for the P-flow, I bought it and got a bigger K&N on it. I'm glad that I
bought the P-flow. I don't know if it's the sound that makes it seem more 
powerful, but it does seem to get more power. It does seem to breath better 
at higher RPM's. As for the bigger K&N, I think that it's more cosmetic than
performance. It fills up the big space left by that huge air filter housing.


Lawrence Wu
LWU2@CSUpomona.edu
Black/Black Corrado SLC
BlackSLC@aol.com

"Quicker than a beaver, hotter than a fever"

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Sep 21 09:47 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 19 Sep 1995 05:13:57 -0700
From: NSnyder@sugar-land.dowell.slb.com (Nick Snyder)
Subject: Chip talk
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Some people keep saying that the Neuspeed chip isn't as noticble of a
difference, as some of the other manufactures.  First off if you want
your chip done a certain way, call APS and talk to Aaron like i did.
Explain what you want and he will help you out.  Aaron goes for the
highest settings he can within reason!!  He doesn't do what some of the
other manufactures do, which is advance the timming WAY to high.
I am on my second APS chip because i wanted some changes to the first
which Aaron did at NO COST.  The original had alot of advanced timing
all the way through the power band.....now it tapers off like it should at
the top end.
It performs much better than the first one did and my top end is MUCH
improved!!  Just my 2 cents!!

       NSnyder@sugar-land.dowell.slb.com
               >>93 Corrado SLC<<
       "Porsche performance at a VW price"


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Oct  6 00:24 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 03 Oct 1995 11:46:15 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Induction tweaks
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    There were a number of posts on the list back in July/August about ways
to implement a cold air induction system after Brian's tests on his VR6 had
found that air with temps as high as 122 F were being sucked into the intake!
  Has anyone come up with anything practical short of removing the passenger
side headlamps?  Brian? Lawrence? Nick?  Did it made a real difference?

   Anyway. Motronix up in Ontario is currently offering a cold air induction
kit, I believe it comes with a 3" duct scoop that attaches to the front
spoiler (if you have a body-kit) or below the front bumper and then a 5 foot
rubber hose to go to the airbox - also the charcoal canister has to be
relocated.  Apparently makes the most difference when your car is moving at
some speed.

   They also are offering a larger diameter (aluminium?) mass air sensor (the
tubing that connects the airbox/P-flo to the throttle body) for more top-end
power, but recommend that the ECU be reprogrammed if this mod is to be
installed.  Other mods include an extrude-honed upper & lower intake manifold
(+11hp, +15lbs torque over stock), modified airbox, 4.5 bar fuel pressure
regulator, and a larger bore throttle body with bigger butterfly flap.

   Speaking of larger-bore throttle bodies, have you had a chance to test
yours for the VR6 yet, Tim?  Guess you're a little backed up after Bruce's
unfortunate accident, sorry to hear about that and hope he'll recover real
soon...  Also wanted to thank Joe and ND for locating those rod bearings for
my 3.1 engine so quickly, and for the Vericom loan - you guys are great!!!

Cheers,
Edward
'92 Black VR6

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Oct  6 00:11 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 03 Oct 1995 09:51:32 -0800 (PST)
From: Lawrence Wu 
Subject: Re: Induction tweaks
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Date sent:  

 >    There were a number of posts on the list back in July/August about ways
 >to implement a cold air induction system after Brian's tests on his VR6 had
 >found that air with temps as high as 122 F were being sucked into the intake!
 >  Has anyone come up with anything practical short of removing the passenger
 >side headlamps?  Brian? Lawrence? Nick?  Did it made a real difference?

I've tried so many different things. Now I have a fan with a current hungry
motor attactched to it. It's sitting right on top of the hole that used to have
the canister. The problem is that it sucks in too much dirt and it's too loud
in my opinion. I tried a strainer, but that got clogged too quickly. So in
short, still working on it. 




Lawrence Wu
LWU2@CSUpomona.edu
Black/Black Corrado SLC
OetCorrado@aol.com
California State Polytechnic University
Pomona, Department of Music

"Quicker than a beaver, hotter than a fever"

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Oct 13 18:28 PDT 1995
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Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 16:23:49 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Yet another 3.1!
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   Yes, folks, I've just heard about another 3.1 Litre VR6 conversion, this
time in a Corrado (finally!) over in New Jersey.  Looks like they threw in
every little mod that's currently available, another project car where money
was no object (like the souped up 3.1 Passat up in Canada, and the
forthcoming 3.1 GTI armed with titanium connecting rods in PA). 

   Details are sketchy, but this Corrado is actually done and running wild on
the road, it's an ABT-theme project with their conversion crank & piston kit,
VSR intake, 17" 3-piece forged rims, etc.  Don't have any dyno figures to
share with you, but Rally Motorsports who built this beast did reportedly
commented that it was "INCREDIBLE, you won't believe how much power this
thing has until you sit in it, nothing else like it out there!".

  At least I don't feel too bad about running up my credit cards despite the
various compromises taken due to financial considerations, though by the time
I'm done with my 3.1,  I'd probably will have spent close to $30,000 for the
original purchase price of the car plus all the engine, transmission and
suspension mods (including labour)!!! (Wonder what other sports car I could
have bought for that kind of money?!)   

   Just hope the performance of my project car will not compare too
unfavourably with some of these other even more pricey highly-modified VR6s.
 I know, I know, I sound like a spoilt brat complaining that I can "only"
spend $10,000 instead of $15-20,000+ on metamorphosizing my baby (I'm waiting
for those inevitable email flames)...but at least I did work somewhat
industriously and saved for over a year in planning this, not to mention
doing considerable research to educate myself on what was available and
worthwhile going for...  ;o)

Cheers,
Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Oct 13 18:59 PDT 1995
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Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 15:17:30 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: EIP mods
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>Would they be doing this all for free?  :)
>
>-Brian
>

   We wish!  I didn't previously post prices as I didn't want to do any
blatant advertising for any particular tuner, unless requested by list
members - but since you asked (and I had admittedly publicised other tuners'
innovative products and services on this list in the past):

1)   VR6 A1 Rabbit        $?
2)   G60 A2 Golf            $?
3)   2.2L 16V Tall Block  $?

4)  Ported & polished VR6 Intake Manifold   $750 exchange
5)  VR6 Throttle Body   $250 exchange
6)  G60 Throttle Body    $350 exchange
7)  Big valve ported & polished VR6 cylinder head   $1595 exchange 
8)  True 3.1L (3104cc) VR6 conversion $4899
9)  3.0L big-bore VR6 package  $2399

BTW, European Import Performance are now online through the AOL account "EIP
TUNING", however they are new to all the computer stuff and may stumble
around a bit, being relatively unfamiliar with net etiquette and such, unlike
our own (and famous) "TurboTim"...

Cheers,
Edward


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Oct 13 19:20 PDT 1995
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Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 22:30:44 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
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Status: RO

 who are interested in engine tweaks, here are some
offerings from European Imports Performance in Maryland (the VW tuner who's
doing my 3.1 Corrado):

1)   VR6 A1 Rabbit
2)   G60 A2 Golf
3)   2.2L 16V Tall Block

4)  Ported & polished VR6 Intake Manifold
5)  VR6 Throttle Body (claimed 24% better flow than Euro 2.9L version)
6)  G60 Throttle Body (claimed 30% better flow than stock)
7)  Big valve ported & polished VR6 cylinder head (claimed 40+ hp gain over
stock when combined with EIP intake & throttle body, plus Schrick cams )
8)  True 3.1L (3104cc) VR6 conversion, similar to my project car which served
as the prototype 
9)  3.0L big-bore VR6 package (includes forged EIP 83mm pistons, 11:1
compression with HPCs, Raceware, Total Seal - for use with stock crank to
achieve up to a claimed 8500 rpm)

If you have questions on the above, please talk to Rich at  (410) 549-1748
(tech line) or (800) 784-8100 (orders).  I have no affiliations with EIP
other than being a satisfied customer.

Edward 



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Oct 23 00:28 PDT 1995
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Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 00:50:52 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: Yet another 3.1!
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   Alright folks, here's more detailed info on the 3.1 Corrado in NJ.  It has
the works, and more...  Using the ABT 3.1 VR6 kit with the 95.6mm crankshaft
and the 92 or 92.5mm pistons as the starting block, Rally Motorsport heaped
on such goodies as the VSR with its specially programmed chip, ABT 268 cams,
ported & polished head with 18% better flow, ABT headers and a monster 70mm
(2.83") exhaust system with the middle muffler eliminated. 

    A special ring & pinion brings down the overall gear ratio for better
acceleration, a Quaife differential helps the application of all this power
to the wheels, and a taller 5th gear allows a theoretical top speed of 160+
mph.   ABT 17" forged rims and pencil-thin Goodyear GS-D 225/35ZR17 rubber
round out this money-no-object package.  The 10.8:1 compression ratio
contributes to a claimed 258 road hp as measured on the dyno  (Rally
estimates that the 3.1 kit by itself bumps road hp up to about 215)!  George
also mentioned that he expects this Corrado to gain another 20-30 hp after it
breaks in...

   Rally has done other interesting projects such as a turbo VR6 GTi for a
customer in Antigua which ran 13lbs of boost (dynoed 305 road hp at 10lbs of
boost), and also the VW Quantum station-wagon Syncro with an Audi 5 cylinder
Turbo motor which impressed so many at the Suffern show.  

   Wow, that 3.1 Corrado sounds pretty incredible, it'd be interesting to see
how the EIP 3.1 project car will compare (one of the EC editors is thinking
of featuring both cars in a comparison test) with its different pistons, head
& exhaust, minus the VSR & ABT headers.  However, much as I'm impressed by
Rally's claim of 258 road hp for their 3.1 motor, I have to admit that it's a
bit difficult to believe that a naturally aspirated 3.1 Litre 12-valve V6,
even if it's our beloved VR6, can deliver 322.5 engine hp (using the standard
formula of engine hp = road hp x 1.25), which would mean that it's putting
out 104 hp/litre making it more efficient than most production cars except
for possibly the Ferrari F50 and F355...maybe I heard wrong and Rally meant
258 engine hp which would seem more reasonable?!

Cheers,
Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sun Oct 22 08:52 PDT 1995
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Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 11:32:46 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Techtonics Dyno Results
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   Have heard that Darrell has made significant progress in his battery of
dyno tests on aftermarket VR6 performance modifications.  Some of his results
are quite surprising, however.  Here's a brief summary:

1)  Schrick 260 cams  -  solid 12 bhp gain over stock.
2)  Schrick & ABT 268 cams - only 1 hp additional gain over the 260, with
some unacceptable power losses in the lower revs!  There was some confusion a
while back about whether these cams were designed properly, but now it
appears that there isn't a real problem with alignment as long as they're
installed properly with the appropiate factory tool...
3)  VW Motorsports VSR - an impressive improvement of 22 to 25 lbs-ft of
torque as claimed.  Wow, makes me wonder now whether I should sell my VSR or
just use it despite running enormously over budget...
4)  Ported & polished cylinder head  - negligible hp gains.
5)  Extrude-honed Intake Manifold  - negligible hp gains.
6)  Sebring (?) headers  - negligible hp gains.
7)  Stock exhaust manifold - too restrictive in terms of how runners are
collected together.

   If anyone can contact Darrell to confirm/dispel the above second-hand
rumours, or at least get more detailed info on his dyno methodology, setup &
environment, that'd be much appreciated.  Nick, Jan? Techtonics' phone number
is 503 843-2700 (they're up in Oregon).

   What concerns me particularly is Darrell's reported results with the 268
cams which I'm planning to put in my project car.  What is the magnitude and
whereabouts in the powerband is this power loss, and why just one measly hp
gain over the 260 cams (whereas other people have stated they experienced a
noticeable improvement when switching from the 260 to 268s)?  Also questions
re the negligible gains with the ported/polished head (What sort of mod was
performed? Was it a Techtonics job?) and the extrude-hone intake (Motronix
claims a dynoed gain of 11bhp)...

Cheers,
Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Oct 23 20:18 PDT 1995
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Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 20:54:11 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Schrick 268 cam hp gains/losses
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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   I've had no luck thus far in finding out more info on Techtonic's claims
that the Schrick & ABT 268 cams only delivers 1 more hp than the 260 cams as
measured on their dyno (with significant losses in the low end), but
according to another well-known VW tuner's dyno measurements on a GTi VR6
equipped with a P-Chip, P-Flo and Euro Throttle Body, adding in a pair of
Schrick 268 cams bumped up output by 12hp @ 6000rpm,  20hp @ 6500rpm, and a
breath-taking 28hp @ 7000rpm, with minimal effects at the bottom end!

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Nov 15 07:10 PST 1995
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Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:56:24 -0500
From: SEKTONE@aol.com
Subject: Re: A super VSR for $750???!
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The intake manifold from EIP does not add 20% more torque it flows 20% more
air than the than the VSR.  This can be great for top end but you may loose a
little torque down low.  I go to EIP weekly and get to drive alot of the cars
there.  The car that is being checked out by Peter Wu on 11-14-95 was just
taken out to 3 liters.  This car as a 2.8 had the early version of EIP's
manifold and schrick 268 cams and easily did 150+ mph.  And this was with the
early manifold that did not flow half as well as the new one.  The price is
excellent and the gains are maximized with higher lift cams.  I dont recomend
just doing the manifold without cams.  I will let everyone know how the 3.0
works out compared to mine.  I have a 93 SLC with an AMS chip,  EIP T.B., and
a AMS K&N air filter unit.  I also have the hard to get OETTINGER grill,
 with Eibach springs and KONI shocks( which we all know dont add h.p. but
looks great).  

ps.  soon to get the works done on my head with bigger valves and thermal
coating, and cams.  Total package is worth about 45bhp.

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Nov 15 07:08 PST 1995
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Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 02:01:55 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: A super VSR for $750???!
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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>The intake manifold from EIP does not add 20% more torque it flows 20% more
>air than the than the VSR.  This can be great for top end but you may loose
a
>little torque down low.
>
   Just got the above email after sending out my response to the "Super VSR"
question, but basically, ditto, nothing comes close to the VSR for that
remarkable 20hp lower-midrange kick, but once the revs get up higher, the
superior performance of the EIP version will make its mark.  And I'd
reprogramme the ECU and add a wilder cam to take advantage of the increased
breathing at the higher rpms...

>The car that is being checked out by Peter Wu on 11-14-95 was just
>taken out to 3 liters.  This car as a 2.8 had the early version of EIP's
>manifold and schrick 268 cams and easily did 150+ mph
>
   EIP's still putting the finishing touches to the 3.0 right as I type
(spoke to them just now, it's almost 2am EST), said the engine started up
really different from stock, a really BIG, DEEP sound.  The Schrick 260s have
been replaced by 268s (a 276 is being considered as this car is raced a lot),
and for now an AMS chip custom-programmed with an 8500rpm rev limiter(!) will
control all this power until the car's been properly dynoed and fine-tuned at
Autothority.  Peter will get to see it tomorrow (unfortunately not broken
in), along with the 2.0L G60 and all the other neat project cars.

>soon to get the works done on my head with bigger valves and thermal
>coating, and cams.  Total package is worth about 45bhp.

   That's what's going into the 3.1, unfortunately my head was done a bit
earlier and so does not have quite as much flow as the current version, oh
well...  You're going to love the improvements in your car!

Edward


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Nov 15 07:08 PST 1995
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Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 01:06:19 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: A super VSR for $750???!
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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>Anybody know any gossip on the modified intake manifold made by EIP VW in
>Maryland? They have an ad on page 22 of this month's EC that claims their
>version gives 20% (!) better torque than the VSR and sells for $750 in
>exchange.  
>
>   VoidSpirit@aol.com


     I'm still (impatiently) waiting for my copy of EC and so haven't seen
the EIP ad, but this highly modified & reworked intake has been available
since the beginning of the year, just hasn't been extensively advertised
until now.  It has been steadily improved since then, and in its current
version flows at least 12% more than even the VSR...  

     I believe the VSR does still make quite a bit more low-midrange torque
due to its unique design, which combines high air velocity at low revs with
high air volume at the higher rpms, but the EIP intake has been demonstrated
on the flow bench to make more at the top end!  On a related note, EIP
recently timed a '92 Corrado VR6 fitted with just this modified intake
manifold, Schrick 268 cams, chip and throttle-body, using a G-Tech meter
(similar to a Vericom), and got a quarter mile reading of 14.58 sec, or
0-60mph in 6.34 sec.

     So it isn't a super VSR, but at $750 (exchange) vs. $2650-$3000, I'm not
exactly complaining!   BTW, the EIP intake was the only acceptable
alternative to the VSR for my project car, and the price difference in
conjunction to my going over-budget was what prompted me to sell my VSR!  Oh,
look out for a tech procedure article on this manifold in the forthcoming Jan
or Feb issue of EC...
    
>also they are offering schrick cams for about $300 less than what
>i've seen everywhere else.

   That's one of the reasons why they're doing my 3.1 (plus, no sales
tax!)...

Edward


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Nov 16 09:57 PST 1995
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Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 09:42:10 -0800
From: Tim Hildabrand 
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: 'Corrado List' 
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From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 23:05:40 -0500
Subject: Re: A super VSR for $750???!

>Do they cut the top off of the 
>manifold to get at these or somthing? I would call EIP and ask, but I 
>doubt they would divulge all their R&D. 
>

>>     I have not yet had a chance to examine one personally, but I believe
that the manifold was cut in several places.  EIP did indeed spend many, many
hours in researching how to optimise air flow through it, and so it wouldn't
be reasonable to expect them to divulge their "secrets", especially as it can
be quite easily duplicated!

>>    The $ (and $750 isn't too bad) we're paying is not so much for the
machining itself as for all the hard work and brainstorming efforts that went
into its design.  Maybe the forthcoming EC article on this manifold will give
you an idea?

I was reading your note, Ed and my new employee Dave Jalali (from a VW dealer 
in Virginia) was reading it and said he saw one of the manifolds and it was 
only ported part of the way in and had not been cut. He said most of the polish 
work looked like it was on the outside. He said the one's Darrell (tectonics) 
did for the 4 cyl. was cut and rewelded as this is the only way to get to the inner 
section without extrudehone. I asked if EIP had a dyno and he did not think so.
So maybe you can find out if the manifold by itself has been dyno tested on a
stock Corrado?  Dave is a very knowlegable person and has owned 2 Corrados a G-60 
and a VR6. His Corrado's were used for all of Autothority's Corrado reasearch. 
He knows the VW performance business and most of the people involved. I will set 
up an internet account for him and get him on the list in the future. Then maybe
he can help me out with all my E-mail. 

**TT**


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Nov 16 17:08 PST 1995
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Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 19:17:17 -0500
From: SEKTONE@aol.com
Subject: Re: No Subject
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I regards to Turbo Tims message about EIP's manifold, the one that Dave
Jahlali inspected was an old one.  Yes it is cut an rewelded, I cant say
exactly how but it is.  It was flow tested against the VSR and the stock
manifold.  The early version that dave saw did not even come close to the
flow of the new manifold.  The first manifold was tested on a bench and it
was dissapointing, then after several long talks with OETTINGER, they got the
specs on the OETTINGER manifold and found out most of the flow was improved
on the left hand side.  EIP then went back to the bench.  Thats about all I'm
allowed to tell you.

Ed Fickert

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Nov 23 14:08 PST 1995
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Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 16:21:44 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: * EIP 3.0L VR6 *
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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    For your info, the EIP 3.0L VR6 project car (a Corrado, of course) was
finished recently and is now running around the Baltimore neighbourhood,
terrorising unsuspecting souped-up pony cars and the like. 

   The performance mods in this motor are very similar to my forthcoming 3.1,
except that it uses the factory crankshaft instead of the ABT longer-stroke
version, and so is able to spin much higher but with less torque lower down
(currently has an 8500rpm rev limit coded in the ECU, but that may be changed
after the dyno).  

   This 3.0L Corrado will be dynoed soon, with the chip custom-programmed &
fine-tuned, and I'll of course report on the results - all I know is it's
getting stronger every day even though revs have been kept low for the
initial breaking in (currently with only a few hundred miles on the engine).

Here are some details on the mods done:
1.   EIP 3.0L VR6 kit w/83mm coated forged pistons, 11:1 compression ratio.
2.   Fully balanced Motor and lightened Flywheel
3.   EIP Big Valve / high-flow Cylinder Head
4.   EIP-designed custom heavy-duty Valve Springs
5.   Titanium Valve Retainers
6.   Schrick 260 deg. cams (will be replaced with 268 or 276 later on)
7.   Raceware rod bolts, head stud & main stud kit
8.   EIP modified Intake Manifold, both upper and lower sections
9.   EIP modified Throttle body
10. EIP coated synchros
11. Sachs Sport Clutch kit
12. Quaiffe Differential

Oh, and this is what Craig (the person on this list who drove my car
cross-country) said to me about the 3.0:

<<      The 3.0 sounded extremely powerful.  The throttle response was 
          phenomenal and the exhaust pressure exiting the tailpipe was 
          intense.  As for the sound...it is loud!  For the street I 
          would definitely desire a more conspicuous car and with this 
          exhaust, that car will certainly turn a few heads.  
          
          I must say that I am impressed with the layout of EIP.  From 
          what I saw, they are true VW engine builders.  Rather than 
          simply bolt on every Neuspeed, ABD and Autotech performance 
          component available to increase power, EIP designs a higher 
          performance motor from the block to the head to the intake 
          manifold.  >>



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Nov 22 10:38 PST 1995
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Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 12:34:06 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: * VR6 Mods *
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(Hmm, seems like a few folks are also experiencing problems with their posts
appearing on the list - I sent the following message yesterday but it never
showed up for me, so here goes again, sorry if you've seen this already!)

**************************
    Just got back from LA, heard that Velocity will be working on a *
super-light * and affordable billet crankshaft for the VR6 (see their ad in
the latest EC issue), with the tantalising option of customising the stroke
length to the customer's request, however this will not be available for
quite a while as they have to finish up their other projects first...  They
are also looking for a test car (Corrado?) to install their big-body VR6
throttle body prototype for testing - any volunteers?

   As for the European Car shoot on a couple of VW outfits on the East Coast,
Peter Wu commented that he was extremely impressed with EIP Tuning and their
whole operation, seems that they are doing some really interesting custom
mods for VWs (as some of us already know) and are not a mostly "off-the-shelf
parts store".  The weather was incredibly bad on the day he was in Maryland,
so unfortunately he did not get a chance to really see how fast some of the
EIP project cars can be, though I did heard rumours of a 2.0L G60 A2  ripping
through the rain/snow at 90+mph...  ;o)

   From his brief experience sitting in the Rally Motorsport 3.1 Corrado,
Peter reported that it was very fast, though first gear gets used up
lightning-fast due to the revised final drive ratio and torque steer is a
significant problem in 1st to 3rd despite the addition of a Quaife.  As
mentioned in an earlier post of mine, their 3.1 is running a compression
ratio of 10.8:1 and has all the goodies. This car will be dynoed by next
week, and I'll report on the results.  Rally has also reportedly done a turbo
VR6 for a customer in Antigua who's racing the car - it runs 13lbs of boost
on a Garrett T3 unit and has an estimated engine output of 325hp (they are
thinking of trying out a Supra turbo on a VR6 next)...

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Nov 21 17:50 PST 1995
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Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 19:51:54 -0500
From: bwhite@thepoint.net (Brian J White)
Subject: Re: New Autotech Q-Chip for VR6...
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Yep...just drop it in .....the only other mod I have is a Neuspeed P-Flo.
No downsides as of yet, but...it has been only 1 day so I cant tell mileage.
ALso...My thermostat has been acting up for the past weekend but today it
really closed up.  Engine gets hot quick.  So I have a new thermo..


68 bucks for a frickin thermostat!!!    Gesh.  Damn VR6! 

Brian


>
>     B-
>     Just drop the sucker in? no other mods?  Any downsides?
>
>       -TX
>         Chris 93 SLC
>______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
>Subject: New Autotech Q-Chip for VR6...
>Author:  corrado-l@teleport.com at Internet
>Date:    11/20/95 10:03 PM
>
>
>     
>Well...I just recevied and installed one of those new Autotech Q-Chips that 
>they are intro pricing at 99 bucks.   
>     
>I have never had any other experience with any other chip (cause they're
>just way to much money )  so this is not a 'comparision' of any kind....BUT.
>     
>     
>The thing pulls like a bastard now.....wonderful throttle response...very 
>jumpy!   I think it was worth 100 bucks. The only pain about installation 
>it trying to get that damn ECU out of the weird ass place VW decided to put 
>it.  
>     
>Anyway...I would recommend this chip to anyone who wants a little mmph out 
>of their VR6 but who just doesnt think a chip is worth 250-300 bucks.....or
>who wanna prep their cars for whatever they see fit...very nice job Autotech...
>     
>Brian
>     
>
>


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Nov 21 02:21 PST 1995
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Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 15:39:11 -0500 (EST)
From: rbeaudette@state.ma.us
Subject: ...no subject...
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Just thought I would pass along this little tidbit.  Brian Jowett graciously 
provided his services in grinding out my throttle body (thanks alot Brian!).  
Now that I have seen what he has done, I can say it is a pretty simple 
modification if you have a grinder handy.

This is really worth the effort.  Before, my Corrado would bog down a bit if 
the shifts were in the low rpm range (necessary now that winter and cold 
engines are here).  It was very annoying and I attributed it to poor driving 
on my part.  I am sure that there is plenty of that left, but the modified 
throttle body has virtually eliminated this hesitation.  The car really feels 
like it wants to accelerate now.  I even noticed an improvement in gas 
mileage on the (long) trip home, maybe about 1 to 1.5 mpg (sounds too good 
though).

I can't say as the modification is worth the price of a new throttle body.  
But if you can find someone with access to air tools, it is worth your time.  
      

Cheers,

Roland 93 SLC (looking at an Autotech chip for x-mas)

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sat Nov 18 01:55 PST 1995
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Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:52:46 -0800
From: Tim Hildabrand 
Subject: ND Exhaust dyno figures for VR6
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Here are correct (4 different cars tested) figures for our exhaust =
systems. The ones we got on our first test with the great numbers did =
not verify and I kick myself for posting them till we did more test. =
Well now that we did do more test we have more accurate data. There is =
still more to do more and from looking at the test our system works =
better with the throttle body,chip and K&N.  We may be able to find more =
power but it may be at the cost of more noise and some bottom end. So =
for now this is the set-up. Both of these are A3 VR6 models. We will get =
around to the Corrado in the future as I will not (anymore) promise =
dates since we have been so busy and projects are getting delayed.=20

All results are WHEEL HP not engine HP.

                    Stock GTI VR6        with ND exhaust           GLX =
with TB/Chip/P-flow       with NDexhaust

3000            86.2                            88.2                     =
              86.9                              89.5
3500            110.0                          111.0                     =
            106.9                            110.7
4000            131.2                          132.4                     =
            131.8                            135.1
4500            144.0                          150.3                     =
            151.4                            153.7
5000            155.2                          161.6                     =
            164.1                            164.4
5500            159.5                          164.6                     =
            170.7                            173.6
6000            162.4                          167.8                     =
            167.4                            174.5
6500              N/A                             N/A                    =
              156.0                            157.6


I will post more as we do more test. All above figures are adjusted for =
temp-humidity and bar/pres.
We will have Aaron at Neuspeed work on a chip for the system as we may =
find more power that way also.

**TT**

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Nov 21 17:01 PST 1995
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Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 18:18:24 +0000
From: cgade@hallam.com
Subject: Re: New Autotech Q-Chip for VR6...
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     B-
     Just drop the sucker in? no other mods?  Any downsides?

       -TX
         Chris 93 SLC
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: New Autotech Q-Chip for VR6...
Author:  corrado-l@teleport.com at Internet
Date:    11/20/95 10:03 PM


     
Well...I just recevied and installed one of those new Autotech Q-Chips that 
they are intro pricing at 99 bucks.   
     
I have never had any other experience with any other chip (cause they're
just way to much money )  so this is not a 'comparision' of any kind....BUT.
     
     
The thing pulls like a bastard now.....wonderful throttle response...very 
jumpy!   I think it was worth 100 bucks. The only pain about installation 
it trying to get that damn ECU out of the weird ass place VW decided to put 
it.  
     
Anyway...I would recommend this chip to anyone who wants a little mmph out 
of their VR6 but who just doesnt think a chip is worth 250-300 bucks.....or
who wanna prep their cars for whatever they see fit...very nice job Autotech...
     
Brian
     

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Nov 30 01:09 PST 1995
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Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:27:15 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Rally's 3.1L Corrado dynoed
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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   First of all, I'd like to apologise to everyone on the list about the
multiple postings of my message re the 16" setup (but thanks for posting it,
Nick), my email to the list wasn't showing up and I was getting
frustrated...in fact, my posts re selling the wheels/tyres have not as yet
shown up for me, though I've received some flak from a couple of people about
repeating myself, so I assume everyone else has received these messages!

   Anyway, Rally's 3.1 ABT-based Corrado has finally been chassis dynoed.  I
do not yet have official figures (you may have to wait for the EC article for
that), or detailed info on its mileage, where it was dynoed and what the
actual road hp for each rpm range is - but the preliminary reading is a max
of 256 engine hp @ 6000rpm and 249 lbs-ft of torque peaking @ 4800rpm
(calculated using some unknown formula from the original, unknown, road hp
measurements).  Oh, here's what another person emailed me about this 3.1:

<< No,. I can't say i ever got to ride in their Corrado,. but i think i
remember my friend bragging abot taking a ride in it,. although I don't know
how well I can believe it..  I did although look at it for a while, it is an
impressive machine. I did hear the car fire,. and whale off down the streets
of Northern NJ,. and it WAS impressive!  I was over at Rally with a friend of
mine who had his Jetta GLi worked on there,. first when i was looking for a
car,. and then just recently to see what they could do for my 8v GTi (which i
bought elsewhere.  Everything they had to sell was way out of what i was
looking to spend.)  The Corrado's allways there,. actually I think the owner
was using it to get back and forth to and from work once and a while.  Hey i
wouldn't mind.  I'm curious however to check out EIP Tuning, I also hear that
they're working on a 2.2L 16v, wow!  Rally Motorsports is a good place,. and
the guy who does most the work really knows his shit,. but I havn't seen too
many projects there in comparison to EIP.   >>



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sat Dec  9 23:04 PST 1995
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Date: Fri, 08 Dec 1995 15:17:09 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: 3.0 & 3.1 VR6 update
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>Do you know the difference between the Schrick 260 and 268?
>Who makes a 276?

   IMHO. Faroodi, the Schrick 260 is highly recommended for the 2.8L VR6 in a
street application if you've decided to go the camshaft route - the idle is
stock-like and you'll get a useful 10 to 12 hp bump in the 6000-6500rpm
range.  If you want to go for a "wilder" cam, the 268 could give you as much
as an extra 20hp over stock, but this peak comes higher up, in the
6800-7500rpm area, and at the expense of some low-mid end torque.  The 276,
also made by Schrick, is even more radical, and is really designed for race
applications where your VR6 has been modified to be capable of going (and
indeed perform best) above the factory redline...the power will be pushed
really high up, and the idle will be quite lumpy (some people might love that
"race car" burble however!).  

   But if you bump up the displacement of your VR6 (as in the 3.0 or 3.1
conversion), you can probably use a wilder cam than the 260 (even in a street
application) so as to take advantage of the larger engine without as much of
a penalty.  I'll leave an explanation of cam duration, lift, lobe angle,
overlap, etc to the technical experts out here...  Another thing to consider
is that installation of these cams will affect your warranty, and the
Schricks and ABT cams do not have a carb exempt # (yet) and so are not legal
in California (they will also increase emissions, but since the VR6 is a very
clean engine to start with, there shouldn't be a major problem passing
inspection)...  Hope that helps somewhat!

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sun Dec 10 09:42 PST 1995
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Date: Fri, 08 Dec 1995 09:56:02 -0500
From: SEKTONE@aol.com
Subject: EIP 3.0 LITER INFO
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Last saturday night I was out at the local car hang out to see what was up
with EIP's  new 3.0 liter kit.  Steve shows up ( employee and owner of the 3
liter), and finally a race is hooked up.  The car that he went up against was
a 92 SLC with a Eurosport exhaust.  Steve gave him a full car start and by
the end of the 1/4 mile was about 4 cars ahead, and this was with backing off
the throttle a few time to taunt him!!!!  Also the car was run at the track
and his E.T. was 14.6 on the first run.  The car was running rough all of
this time and when it was inspected it was found that he had all of this
performance on only FIVE OF HIS CYLINDERS.  This car was that fast and it
only had been running on five cylinders.  It is now getting fixed and they
are putting in wilder cams to make it even sicker.  est. of 14.0-13.9. are
expected.

I'll keep you posted.

ED FICKERT

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Dec 12 14:16 PST 1995
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Date: Tue, 12 Dec 95 13:15:01 TZ
From: Scott McAlear  (RhoTech)
Subject: Re: vr6 cams
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Message-ID: red-55-msg951212211436MTP[01.51.00]000000c9-26333

Talking to Shawn at Ron's Parts he has said the opposite; 260's are 
really the only way to go.  Much smoother & more driveable.

Scott
----------
| From: Brian J White  
| To:  
| Subject: Re: vr6 cams
| Date: Tuesday, December 12, 1995 2:18PM
|
|
| What is 'silly' about the 260....just dont get the bang for buck or what???
|
| B
|
| >However, other sources, e.g., EIP and Ron's, have implied that the 260
| >is silly and that the 268 is the one to go for.
| 



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Dec 13 23:06 PST 1995
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Date: Wed, 13 Dec 1995 21:47:22 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: EIP 3.0 LITER INFO
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>This car was that fast and it
>only had been running on five cylinders.  It is now getting fixed and they
>are putting in wilder cams to make it even sicker.  est. of 14.0-13.9. are
>expected.

   I hear that the limited production 276 cams should be installed in the 3.0
Corrado by this weekend.  Prior to this modification, the C, sporting the
Schrick 260s, had hit a tad over 7000rpm (quite comfortably) several times on
the belt parkways, which would translate to the 155mph region with the US
gearing!  The 260s reportedly pulled strongly from as low as 4000rpm, but
tended to top out in the low 6k revs, hence their replacement with the rather
radical 276 cams.  Expect to see this Corrado competing at the Battle of the
Imports or equivalent events once it manages to achieve sub-14 second 1/4
mile times... 

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Dec 13 08:39 PST 1995
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Date: Mon, 11 Dec 1995 17:27:27 +0000
From: Tim at ND 
Subject: VR6 cams
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Status: RO

Faroodi says:
>Do you know the difference between the Schrick 260 and 268?
>Who makes a 276?

Edward replies:
  IMHO. Faroodi, the Schrick 260 is highly recommended for the 2.8L
  VR6 in a
street application if you've decided to go the camshaft route - the
idle is stock-like and you'll get a useful 10 to 12 hp bump in the
6000-6500rpm range.  If you want to go for a "wilder" cam, the 268
could give you as much as an extra 20hp over stock, but this peak
comes higher up, in the 6800-7500rpm area, and at the expense of some
low-mid end torque.  The 276, also made by Schrick, is even more
radical, and is really designed for race applications where your VR6
has been modified to be capable of going (and indeed perform best)
above the factory redline...the power will be pushed really high up,
and the idle will be quite lumpy (some people might love that "race
car" burble however!).  Another thing to consider is that installation
of these cams will affect your warranty, and the Schricks and ABT cams
do not have a carb exempt # (yet) and so are not legal in California
(they will also increase emissions, but since the VR6 is a very clean
engine to start with, there shouldn't be a major problem passing
inspection)...  Hope that helps somewhat!

Tim says:
I would not recommend the 268 or the 276 for anyone who will have to
have their Corrado pass smog. While you may get away with the 260 the
other two may have a hard time passing the smog test that will be
coming to all 50 states not just California. I personally do not like
cars with(wild cams) lumpy idle's as they usually are putting out high
emmissions and lose too much bottom end for the extra hp at high rpm.
Ed I am not sure how you will get your Corrado to pass smog but this
is something everyone needs to be concerned about for the future. I am
glad to finally see almost no articles on dual carb conversions
anymore as everytime E-car ran one we would get a bunch of calls from
readers who want to do this to there VW. After explaining that fuel
injection is far superior and all the other negatives of carbs
including not being smog legal they start to understand. Our philosphy
at ND is smog legal hp not something you will be sorry for later. Sure
we miss out on sales of all the illegal stuff like cams, headers,
etc... And we have to turn many jobs down because the stuff the
customers wants us to install is not legal. I have a responsibility to
my customers and employees to stay in business and do not believe the
risk is worth it. Eurosport in LA was busted a few years ago and they
got lucky and survived all the penalties and fines. 

**TT**
turbotim@newdimensions.com
http://www.newdimensions.com

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Dec 12 21:36 PST 1995
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Date: Wed, 13 Dec 1995 00:01:02 -0500
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Re: New EC, VR6 syncro, Motor Technik add
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No sour grapes or anything but NO ONE from any company other than EIP is
responsible for the EIP TUNING VR6 big valve head. The valves are actually
custom built to our specs by a performance valve manufacturer. The thermal
barrier coating ( as well as all other HPC's ) are applied by a performance
coating company that specializes in this technology.  

Sorry SEKTONE, you've been very misinformed!

------------------> Rich <--------------------

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Jan  2 20:49 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 02 Jan 1996 23:01:08 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Finally!...3.0L VR6!!
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   Well, I couldn't hold off any longer, and so am posting a message that EIP
had put up on the Car & Driver Message Forums on America On-Line over the
weekend about their 3.0L project car.  I'm doing this without prior consent
from EIP (and to make things worse, with some hasty, minor editing!), so
sorry, Rich, I just had to share this information ASAP, hope you won't mind
and please don't detune a few hps from my 3.1 in retaliation...

Cheers,
Edward

******************************************************************************
******
Subj:  Finally!...3.0L VR6!!
Date:  95-12-30 23:05:24 EST
From:  EIP TUNING      

Just thought I'd drop a quick note about our completed 3.0L shop project. We
have been tearing down and re-assembling this particular VR6 motor for
several months now to track wear and break in patterns of our newly designed
3.0L kit. Through this comprehensive and exhaustive process, we have been
able to make several important modifications to the kit to ensure trouble
free performance, in addition to extracting the best possible power from our
motor / kits. 
    The completed 3.0L has definitely met and exceeded our original goals.
 Far more than just putting together a kit such as ABT's, we have developed a
complete motor that delivers some rather impressive power even at such an
early stage. We had initially expected a considerable loss of low end torque
since we decided to use Schricks rare and rather radical 276 degrees cam set.
The beauty is, due to the 3.0L's much improved power (thanks to its 11:1
compression ratio and 83mm pistons etc.), the car pulls stronger than any
stock or modified 2.8L VR6 I've driven, even at 2000-3000 rpm. The motor
starts pulling hard above 4000 and gets much stronger above 5500 rpm. We have
just put it together in its current configuration, and have not as yet spin
it past 6500 rpm, due to our belief in a somewhat "gentle" break in period
(1000 miles or so). By the way, the motor is quite capable of doing over 8000
rpm. 
    We had the opportunity to run against a Mitsubishi Eclipse Turbo last
night, well even when short shifting at 6K we ran away from him from 60 mph
onwards  till we let off at about 120mph. We put at least ten car lengths on
him to that speed, and the 3.0L only starts getting mean at above 100mph. We
would have really hurt his pride if we would have been shifting in the power
band!
    We also ran the 3.0L against one of our fastest VR6 products, a
heavily-modified Golf A2 with a 2.8L VR6 incorporating our big valve ported &
polished head, wilder cams, EIP custom modified throttle body and intake
manifold, programmed chip, etc. (our customer has also added a 6-line, 100hp
NOS system just in case!). This Golf has run better than 13.8 sec in a
quarter mile running on 17" wheels (13.2s or better should be possible with
15" wheels and sticky tires). To come to the point, the 3.0L Corrado pulls
harder shifting at 6k than the Golf (off the bottle of course) shifting well
into its power band at about 7200 rpm!  Should be fun in a week or so when
the Corrado is finally broken in... 
    Dyno results will be available soon. I'll report more fun later.

--------------------> RICH !! <---------------------- 
******************************************************************************
******

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sat Jan  6 19:58 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 06 Jan 1996 22:21:13 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: EC article on Rally's 3.1 Corrado
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   Just chatted with Peter Wu about his article in European Car on the Rally
3.1 ABT Corrado, and his response to my questions about a couple of things in
that article was as follows:

1)  Loss of low-end torque below 3000 rpm -  this was felt rather than
measured, and Peter attributes it to all the porting & polishing that was
performed (as well as the wilder cams) which increases air volume and
therefore flow at high rpms, but at the expense of air velocity in the lower
revs.  Another culprit may have been the modified exhaust system which may
have had a straight-thru pipe thru the catalytic converter, thus not
generating enough back pressure.  Peter noted that he has never driven/sat in
a modified VR6 that did not exhibit some losses in the low end relative to
stock...

2)   The 168mph @ 6200rpm claim -  Peter mentioned that this figure was
supplied to him by George and was apparently derived from some computer
charts Rally had.

   I could not get hold of George this weekend, but will try to talk to him
soon.  Meanwhile, let's not make any hasty assumptions or judgements until we
have contacted all the parties involved and get their
feedback/explanations...

Your roving reporter,
Edward

P.S.  By the way, the photo shoot of that red C. almost didn't come about as
Peter was initially chased away by a security guard...

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Jan  5 23:14 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 06 Jan 1996 01:37:07 -0500 (EST)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Re: EIP CORRADO IN EC
In-Reply-To: <960106010529_84678057@mail06.mail.aol.com>
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The reason the car lost low end is because of the cams. I have a friend 
who lives in Manhatan, and goes out to Rally Motorsports on occasion. He was 
lucky enough to get a ride in this car. He said that it did feel a little 
weeker down low, but once it came on cam (3500-4000rpm) hold the f... on! 
He also said it was the stiffest car he ever rode in. He runs Nuespeed 
race springs and sport Bilsteins in his Jetta GLX.

Brian 93 VR6                                            

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Jan  5 22:49 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 06 Jan 1996 01:05:30 -0500
From: SEKTONE@aol.com
Subject: EIP CORRADO IN EC
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To all of the great corrado owners on the list.  The car featured in the new
issue of EC is not from EIP it is from Rally Motorsports, in New Jersey.  The
EIP car will be featured later on in the year when it is dynoed, and timed at
the track.  This will lead to an article that is TRUTHFULL AND RELIABLE.  The
car from Rally is a 3.1, while the one from EIP is a 3.0.  With all of the
extensive headwork and bigger valves plus other mods I think the world is in
for a shock when you see the hp figures for the 3.0.  Dont be suprised when
it is higher than the 3.1.  Peter Wu is a great guy but I think the guys at
rally slipped him a mickie in his drinks.  How can you loose bottom end while
increasing displacement.  Also how can that car do 168mph with the final
drive of a 16v corrado?  It would actually lower top speed, while increasing
accelaration.  168mph could be done with the stock VR6 final drive though.
 One more point to be made, the only reason that car beat an M3 was that it
had the factory rev limiter on it, I belive it is around 137mph?  I can do
more than that and my cams are not in yet.  

Just thought you should know,  Ed F.

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Jan  5 22:01 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 06 Jan 1996 00:04:47 +0000
From: bad90g@epix.net
Subject: Re: EPI VR6 in EC magazine
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> From:          UniqueVR6@aol.com
> Date:          Fri, 5 Jan 1996 21:50:52 -0500
> To:            corrado-l@teleport.com
> Subject:       Re: EPI VR6 in EC magazine
> Reply-to:      corrado-l@teleport.com


>    My only question about the article is as follows: "...changed the final
> drive ratio from 3.65 to 3.94 by using the final drive gear from a 2.0 16V
> Corrado. Computer gear charts project 168mph in fifth gear at 6200 rpm" -
> according to the calculations I had posted before based on the formula that
> Karl had supplied, this final drive ratio change will actually decrease top
> speed to about 130mph at 6200rpm using the standard US 5th gear (0.84), and
> 150mph using the rather radical 0.72 ratio 5th gear.  So, is Karl's formula
> or EC's computer charts to blame for this apparent discrepancy?
> 
> Edward
> 
>

EC is wrong.  The top speed would be lowered by the following final 
drive modification.  Can the EIP VR6 be revved beyond factory 
redline?  If so, this could explain the discrepancy.  By my 
calculations, the engine would have to be able to rev to approx. 
8000 rpm.  The top speed with a 3.94  final drive, 0.838 5th gear, 
and 225/40/16's @ 8000 rpm would be 166.44 mph.  Maybe EC meant to 
say 168 mph at 8000 rpm :-)

225/40/16, 3.647-FD, 0.838-5th @ 6200 = 139.35 mph
225/40/16, 3.94-FD, 0.838-5th @ 6200 = 128.99 mph
225/40/16, 3.647-FD, 0.72-5th @ 6200 = 162.19 mph
225/40/16, 3.94-FD, 0.72-5th @ 6200 = 150.13 mph

Matt Heffner
'90 Pearl Blue G60

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Jan  5 19:16 PST 1996
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Date: Fri, 05 Jan 1996 21:50:52 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: EPI VR6 in EC magazine
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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   Well, I finally received my copy of the Jan '96 issue of European Car
about 15 minutes ago, and after quickly browsing through the various stuff
(there's a tech feature on installing the Quaife in a G60, a letter about the
SLC in endurance racing, Velocity's 245hp turbo A2 GTi, and features on the
911S & 240hp 318ti S3 3.0, etc), turned straight to the "Beast from the East"
article on page 128 that Karl/Voidspirit had mentioned about.  This is
actually the Rally Motorsports' ABT Corrado ("with all the goodies thrown
in") that I had referred to on several occasions in the past, not EIP's
version.

   My first impression?  Definitely was exciting reading about all the mods
they threw into that car, and it sure looks sharp and mean! Finally we get to
read about a highly-modified C and about its thrilling performance!. Would
probably have enjoyed the article even more if there had been some additional
data included such as the 3.1's hp & torque curve and some timing runs...

   Anyway I look forward to seeing how my project car will turn out relative
to this beast, should be a really interesting comparison.  Basically my C.
won't enjoy the benefits of a VSR or ABT headers (my bank account will be
grateful for that fact though ), or look as flashy from the Oettinger body
kit/Zender wing/ABT wheels (again $$ savings!), but I have the utmost
confidence that EIP's unique big-valve head and true 3.1L pistons (83mm vs
ABT's 82.01mm) will more than make up for that apparent deficit...

   My only question about the article is as follows: "...changed the final
drive ratio from 3.65 to 3.94 by using the final drive gear from a 2.0 16V
Corrado. Computer gear charts project 168mph in fifth gear at 6200 rpm" -
according to the calculations I had posted before based on the formula that
Karl had supplied, this final drive ratio change will actually decrease top
speed to about 130mph at 6200rpm using the standard US 5th gear (0.84), and
150mph using the rather radical 0.72 ratio 5th gear.  So, is Karl's formula
or EC's computer charts to blame for this apparent discrepancy?

Edward

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Sat Jan  6 00:07 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 06 Jan 1996 02:19:01 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: Rally's 3.1 Corrado in EC
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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>The reason the car lost low end is because of the cams. I have a friend 
>who lives in Manhatan, and goes out to Rally Motorsports on occasion. He was

>lucky enough to get a ride in this car. He said that it did feel a little 
>weeker down low, but once it came on cam (3500-4000rpm) hold the f... on! 

   I think a chart of the 3.1's hp curve vs rpm, as measured on the dyno,
should resolve this question properly.  On the one hand, we have EC and
Brian's friend reporting that Rally's 3.1 felt weaker down there from
personal experience, but then Sektone, VoidSpirit, Karl and I all seem to
feel that, in theory at any rate, this 3.1 should have a better bottom end
than a stock 2.8 (despite the wilder cams) since it has a longer stroke
crank, bigger displacement (from larger pistons and longer crank stroke), and
the VSR in addition to the revised gearing, all of which should translate to
better low-end grunt!

   If I get time tomorrow (go Niners!), I'll try to talk to George from Rally
and Peter Wu from EC about this issue, plus the 168mph @ 6200rpm claim in the
article...

Cheers,
Edward


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Jan 12 12:42 PST 1996
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Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 14:16:14 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: GTA's 2.9L VR6
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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    For those power-hungry enthusiasts who may be interested, here 's=
 some
info on a modified 2.9L VR6 project car that was recently completed b=
y the
GTA folks (Georges, Louis) up in Quebec.  This was supplied to me by =
Frank
who apparently talked to GTA directly, so I can not vouch for the acc=
uracy of
this report (Frank's first language is French so please excuse any sp=
elling &
grammatical errors).=20

    BTW, I haven't checked in with Richie up in Vancouver for a while=
 now
about how his 3.1 Passat is doing, and whether it's well on its way t=
o
twin-turbodom - those international phone calls are not cheap!  But w=
ill
update you all later...

************************************************
The car is from US, w/cat, and he=92s going to England not far from n=
ow.
-2.8L VR6 modified up to 2.9L
-All stuff balanced
-VSR with VW MOTORSPORTS chip
-GTA head (ported and polished, 3 or 4 angle job, 50/50)
-Suko hollow 268 cams (ABT)
-Schrick HD valve springs
-Titanium valve retainers
-German T-Body and P-Flow
-ABT headers
-Remus square muffler, but he=92s now changing for AutoTech 3=BE - 4 =
inchs round
stainless=20
muffler.=20
-AutoTech rear upper-stut bar (No huge Neuspeed inside-rear double tr=
iangles
bars)
-Oettinger front upper-strut bar (great styling and doesn't touch any=
thing)
-No sway bars - they are not necessary on that car if you have the su=
spension
and another little thing
-Eibach GERMAN springs, not US ones
-Bilstein shocks
-Neuspeed short shift kit (works really well, about CAN$450/US$380)
-Stock gear ratio
-No limited slip diff at the moment (that's next)
-205/40/17 tires
-Awsome sound system (maybe he had it before)

-Power: 260hp
-Torque: 240-250lbs-ft
-this is estimated power, with infos giving by guys in Europe, where =
lots of
Cs have been modified like=20
that. They said that if you put this, and this, and this mod, it=92ll=
 give X
hp. There=92s 10% of possible=20
errors. He said it=92s not really necessary to check on dyno. The hp =
and torque
is developed at=20
around 6200rpm.=20

-RPM is in lower revs and he can't go really high, cuz maybe the engi=
ne could
have problems, due to the=20
 lesser thickness of the Canada 2.8 chambers compared to the Euro 2.9=
.
Georges Grisanti said that the Euro 2.9 engine block is THICKER & STR=
ONGER
than the US 2.8 motor,=20
so can tough longer and is a bit more powerful, and you can see the
difference when driving it...

-It's winter, so couldn't check the acceleration time

The guy puts up to CAN$12,000/US$8,825 only on the engine, exhaust an=
d
shifter, including the=20
installation, W/O the VSR!!! Cuz the guy already had the VSR...
Of course, you must also add the cost of the shocks/springs, tires/ri=
ms,
stereo and bars. The total is... a lot...
With everything, maybe more expensive than your 3.1!

I'll try to talk with the guy this summer... for fun... and sound... =
;-)

Georges said that you have to be careful if you put 215 or 225, or 17=
, cuz if
you overload the=20
back, with a stereo and/or passengers, maybe it could rub on the fend=
ers and
the bumpers...

Rabbit GTI 180hp, great uh? From GTA.
1992 GTI 16V, 250hp... from GTA again... they're great, for tuners in=
=20
Quebec... But I'm sure EIP can do better... I think... anyway...

Hey! How come that Rally 3.1 VSR has ONLY 256hp, and GTA's 2.9 VSR ha=
s more
power at 260hp?? Strange... really...
************************************************





From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Mon Jan 15 22:50 PST 1996
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Date: Mon, 15 Jan 1996 13:09:57 -0800 (PST)
From: rich@amcc.com (Ricardo Higgins)
Subject: Chip Warning
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: corrado-l@teleport.com (Corrado list)
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In Nov. I bought a Autotech chip for my VR6. I had to hastle
with them because they didn't want to believe my chip was socketed
from the factory. The price was so good I put up with this.

Fri. night the car didn't want to start, three tries with long cranking
and it finaly caught. The car ran very rough, but it ran. On the drive home
the car idled rough but it seemed to have power under loadOn the  

From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Jan 18 00:20 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 10:28:59 -0500
From: bwhite@thepoint.net (Brian J White)
Subject: Re: Chip Warning
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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I have the Autotech chip as well..and have never had a problem with it.  I
have also been really pleased with its result.   The car never takes twice
to start now..starts first try.   And the throttle response and quickness of
the speed is impressive.  I would really be curious to try the Neuspeed
and/or Autothority chips though. 

Anyway...why didnt Autotech wanna beleive that your ECU was socketted??
What year VR6 and what kind of box did it have??  I was my impression that
ALL Corrados have socketted chips and that VW didnt start soldering until
the later in the A3 Golf/Jetta series (i.e. if you have a 1994 Golf chances
are that the ECU has a socket, but if you have a 1996 car, chances are that
it is soldered.)


Brian

>In Nov. I bought a Autotech chip for my VR6. I had to hastle
>with them because they didn't want to believe my chip was socketed
>from the factory. The price was so good I put up with this.
>
>Fri. night the car didn't want to start, three tries with long cranking
>and it finaly caught. The car ran very rough, but it ran. On the drive home
>the car idled rough but it seemed to have power under loadOn the  
>


From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Thu Jan 18 02:34 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 16:07:29 -0800 (PST)
From: rich@amcc.com (Ricardo Higgins)
Subject: RE: Chip Warning
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: corrado-l@teleport.com (Corrado list)
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In Nov. I bought a Autotech chip for my VR6. I had to hastle
with them because they didn't want to believe my chip was socketed
from the factory. The price was so good I put up with this.

Fri. night the car didn't want to start, three tries with long cranking
and it finally caught. The car ran very rough, but it ran. On the drive home
the car idled rough but it seemed to have power under load. I live about
5 miles from work, midway the check engine light came on. For two days
this persisted I finally got smart and swapped the factory chip back in. 
The car initially started hard but all problems were gone after the first 
mile or so.

Autotech told me to mail the chip back and they'd check it out. I'll be
putting in the mail sometime this week and I'll keep you all posted.

Ric

PS sorry my previous post got cut off.




From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Fri Jan 19 01:52 PST 1996
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Date: Fri, 19 Jan 1996 04:13:29 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: 300 HP VR6 debate (long)
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: corrado-l@teleport.com
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Hi all,
I just came across the following thread on America On-Line's Car & Dr=
iver
message forums, and thought it might be of interest to some of us (as=
 long as
it doesn't lead to the emotional debate that the recently-departed Ma=
rk's
messages provoked!)...

Cheers,
Edward
92 VR6 (soon to become a 3.1L, one of these days...)

*******************************************************
Subj:  Re:16V-Syncro conversion
Date:  96-01-09 09:21:33 EST
=46rom:  Rowdy Rat      =20

Actually, it's a case of having more horsepower than available tracti=
on.
 With currently available modifications, the VR6 (I know the original=
 post
was about a 16v car, but I'm more concerned with the VR6) is currentl=
y
capable of putting out over 300 horsepower (and I've heard rumors of =
turbo
VR6s near 400 horsepower).  The front wheel drive layout of the curre=
nt
Volkswagen is unable to cope with these horsepower levels and the mos=
t
efficient way to correct this is to put the power down through all fo=
ur
wheels.  I agree that the Syncro system with its viscous coupling rea=
r
differential may not be the most durable choice, but it should live o=
n the
street.

Show me a way to get that much power to the ground with FWD and I'll =
forget
about AWD.

*******************************************************
Subj:  Re:16V-Syncro conversion
Date:  96-01-09 11:00:07 EST
=46rom:  RACEWARE1      =20

Maybe I missed a message along the way, but I haven't seen any REAl T=
urbo'ed
VR6 engines at 300-400 HP. Porsche did a Turbo deal for the Sharan Va=
n for
last years Frankfurt Auto Show and it was 252 PS. I'm not saying it's
impossible to obtain 300 HP with enough boost and intercooling, but 4=
00 HP is
highly improbable for "street" use. For racing, it may be possible wi=
th a lot
of rework, but there are limits. By the way, don't believe everything=
 you
read in the hot rod magazines or parts catalogs. There's a lot of B.S=
. out
there from people trying to get at your wallet...

Regards,
Randy
*******************************************************
Subj:  Syncro conversion / 300+ HP
Date:  96-01-10 09:15:50 EST
=46rom:  Rowdy Rat      =20

Let me fill you in on where I was headed Randy...

First off the possibility of a streetable 300+ horsepower VR6 is a re=
ality.
 EIP Tuning has been working on a couple of naturally aspirated VR6s =
(3.0
liter and 3.1 liter) that should be right at the 300 horsepower mark =
- I am
told that dyno testing is currently being completed.  Ron=92s Parts h=
as also
been busy with a turbocharged 3.1 liter VR6 with about 350 horsepower=
.  A
turbocharged VR6 engine should be good for about 150 horsepower per l=
iter and
still remain drivable on a regular basis - that should put you at abo=
ut 450
horsepower.  I don=92t really see any major problems, but durability =
becomes a
question with any modified engine.  In any case 250 horsepower seems =
to be
about the limit for FWD Volkswagens; after that you get severe torque=
 steer
and the first several gears become virtually useless as a result of w=
eight
transfer away from the drive wheels (wheelspin is reduced with a limi=
ted slip
differential, but it is still a problem).  My point was why go to all=
 the
trouble and expense of building a high horsepower engine if you can=
=92t make
use of the additional power?

The solution that I proposed was putting the Syncro driveline underne=
ath
giving the car AWD capability. Gemnicj pointed out some of the flaws =
with
this plan - high cost, durability of the Syncro parts, and the proble=
ms
associated with acquiring the parts.  All of these arguments are vali=
d, but
unfortunately do not solve the problem of getting the power down.  Mo=
st of
the manufacturers have experimented with AWD (Volkswagen included) an=
d it
will solve the problem.  However, I am open to other ideas and if som=
eone has
another solution, I would love to hear about it (I=92ve heard Audi ha=
s a few
new FWD tricks).  Let=92s hear from you!

*******************************************************
Subj:  Re:300/400 HP VR6's
Date:  96-01-10 19:06:00 EST
=46rom:  RACEWARE1      =20

Thanks for your input regarding the VR6 engine. EIP is one of our cus=
tomers
and you can be certain they are working expeditiously to develop the =
VR6
engine for maximum performance.

I have not personally checked with EIP to see what the latest develop=
ments
are but, the one report I read of a 3.1L conversion, used 276 degree =
cams,
and other mods that would be much more toward the hotrod end of the s=
pectrum
than what is typically considered a "streetable" configuaration. If E=
IP is
able to develop a 300 HP, 3.0L engine that is "streetable" and meets =
all
emission standards, etc. then they have been able to succeed where al=
l the
other automotive engineers of the World have not. A 100 HP per litre =
for a
normally aspirated engine is certainly possible, and has already been
attained by certain car manufacturers, but only at the sacrifice of l=
ow end
torque and with peak power at a very high rpm.

If you look at some of the existing production turbo'ed models like t=
he
Porsche 944 and other 2-valve per cylinder engines, you will find tha=
t even
with modified boost levels and chips, these engines are making peak p=
ower of
about 120/litre. That's not shabby, but these engines are also on the=
 edge of
reliability, even with robust engine design. To expect a reliable 450=
 HP 3.0L
VR6 is asking a lot.

I spent over a year developing a Turbo'ed Olds Quad 4 engine for
Buick-Old-Cadillac Engineering, and it was a neat project. At 8.5 psi=
 boost
this engine would make a reliable 265 HP with excellent low end driva=
bility.
At 14 psi boost the power jumped to 314 HP, on pump gasoline, thru a
catalytic convertor, etc. This is certified engine dyno power to SAE =
test
procedures. At the 314 HP level you end up with 136 HP/litre. We did =
not run
durability tests at this level, but at the 265 HP level we ran (2) en=
gines at
Wide Open Throttle, (WOT) for 400 hours each without difficulty. I do=
n't
believe this would be possible at the 136/litre level.

The current Porsche 993 twin turbo produces 400 HP from 3.6L or 111 H=
P per
litre. Keep in mind that this is a 2-valve Hemi head design that flow=
s quite
well. The Quad 4 is a 4-valve engine. The VR6 is a 2-valve design wit=
h a less
efficient chamber shape in the piston crown. VW Research did a study =
of the
VR6 with a 4-valve head and reached peak power of 225 HP. The odds ar=
e not
good of seeing a true, streetable 300 HP, 3.0L VR6 or a 450 HP, 3.0L =
Turbo'ed
VR6. I would be interested in seeing any of the dyno sheets for the l=
atest
developments. It might prove very interesting.

You are correct that you would need AWD to harness this kind of power=
. In '89
I viewed the Golf Syncro with the Turbo'ed 1.8L 16V, 210 HP, at VW Mo=
torsport
in Germany. It was a nice package, but extremely expensive. It was OK=
 for the
street but as you know it could not handle the stress of Rally Racing=
. I'm
not aware of any good solution to you problem, but I will give it som=
e
thought.

Regards,
Randy Hubbard
*******************************************************
Subj:  Re:300/400 HP VR6's
Date:  96-01-11 00:45:43 EST
=46rom:  Gemnicj        =20

  With bench racing, we always seem to tolerate a certain amount of b=
ullshit
as long as we learn something new that we can use or distort later. L=
et's be
honest though. We all try to assert that "mine is better/faster than =
yours"
or "I know more than you do". That's the fun of it, and in and of its=
elf
is...OK I'm told. Excuse me for being way too sensible about this, bu=
t
expecting a VW A2 or A3 platform manage over 300 HP makes me wonder w=
hen all
this enthusiasm is gonna get the better of us. Especially when the fr=
ee and
easy use of the term "streetable" is mentioned in the same breath. Al=
low me
to give you some personal insights as to why I feel so critical.
  First off, l must say that many, many years ago, I used to be like =
you'all.
I dreamed and lusted after the almighty HP, but unfortunately could n=
ot
afford it. My poverty however, led me to an interesting discovery. Af=
ter way
too many stupid street racing close calls and tickets, I took my trus=
ty new
84 GTI, joined a local club and began competing regularly in CASC Sol=
o I and
Solo II events. I wanted soooo badly to run with the guys in Street P=
repared
class, what with their fancy-schmancy wheels, trick suspensions, cams=
 and
headers ..arrrrrgh. As the single set of Yoko A008s I bought almost b=
roke the
bank, here I was stuck in Stock. Yuk.
   After a couple of club school sessions, I learned quickly and deve=
loped a
relationship with the able GTI. As I began to win my class regularly =
at the
end of the first full season, I studied the techniques of the seasone=
d
drivers and started to pay more attention to the time sheets from oth=
er
classes. Of particular interest was the performance of a group runnin=
g
modified 83 and 84 GTIs in SP. With the Drake mods that were popular =
for GTIs
at the time, over 120HP was possible. Compared to my bone stock 90 HP=
, I
expected them to be significantly quicker. They even looked and sound=
ed
quicker. To my surprise they were not. In fact, on any given weekend,=
 the
quickest of the trio (who usually finished 3rd or 4th in his class) w=
as never
quicker than my Stock class winning times. On a tight Solo II course =
this was
not unusual as barely 3 seconds covered the entire weekends entry any=
way.
However, when we ran Solo I weekends on the fast circuit at Shannonvi=
lle
however, his times were generally on par with mine. On wet weekends I=
 was
always quicker than all of them. This was obviously cause for concern=
 as
these fine young gentlemen had spent a ton-o-money and emotion on the=
ir
prized rides only to be equaled or bettered by a stock GTI or the CRX=
 that
usually accompanied me on the podium. Upon further perusal of the tim=
e
sheets, I found this to be the case with ALL classes. There was alway=
s a
consistent overlap of Stock vs Prepared times for identical models. F=
ade to
black.
  New scene: 1992 Canadian Firestone Firehawk Endurance
Championship...Mosport Park.....In car camera footage from our Schmid=
t Racing
Corrado VR6 (Raceware equipped) ..... all we see is the dirty hindqua=
rters of
some obscene looking Camaro, bobbing and weaving and burbling. As we =
review
the qualifying footage back at the motel, Gunter is furious. Two of t=
he
infamous "slower Camaros" ruin a qualifying run that could have put u=
s on the
Sport Class pole. Let's do some math..Corrado =3D approx. 180 hp. Fir=
ehawk
Camaro =3D approx. 245 hp. Qualifying times for BOTH
cars =3D 1:45.3. ....Gunter's, Alistar's, Peter's and my avg. lap tim=
es at
Mosport =3D 1:44.5. Fade to black. I guess the moral to all this is..=
 To value
the ownership of a 300 hp Corrado strictly for the bench racing value=
 is
really stoopid. I for one won't be impressed. Get over finding a way =
to get
the power to the ground with AWD. Even if you can afford to further m=
olest
the poor car, it is not gonna happen. Instead, learn to appreciate an=
d use
effectively what you have. The phrase "size doesn't matter...it's how=
 you use
it" comes to mind. They say that a good driving school makes you just=
 as
quick as the equivalent amount spent on bolt-ons. Believe it and be h=
ealed!=20

JG
*******************************************************



From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Jan 24 11:37 PST 1996
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Date: Wed, 24 Jan 1996 12:51:19 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: ABT 3.1
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: corrado-l@teleport.com
Reply-To: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Message-Id: <960124125113_205593651@emout04.mail.aol.com>
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Status: RO

> Can you please 
>call up the tuner and asking the price for these modification??

   Be forewarned, the 3.1 mod is definitely rather pricey (understatement of
the century!), especially if you decide to do an all-out project like the one
featured in the February 1996 issue of European Car.  Contact Rally directly
via email at RALLYMSRPT@aol.com if you have questions about the cost of their
project.  One of the official ABT distributors in the US is JT Motorsports in
Southern California, but as some others on the list can attest to, JT charges
much more than most tuners for the ABT stuff and has a reputation of being a
bit opinionated on this subject. 

   North American tuners who have done ABT-based larger displacement VR6
conversions include EIP Tuning, Ron's Parts, GTA, Rally, and AMS (this is not
an exhaustive, all-inclusive listing). Of the above-mentioned, I would
personally recommend EIP (EIPTUNING@aol.com) as they offer their own
innovative performance mods in addition to the German-imported
ABT/Oettinger/Schrick stuff, plus their prices and service compare quite
favourably with most of the competition...

Cheers,
Edward

1992 Black 3104cc VR6

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Jan 29 08:44 PST 1996
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Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 09:22:52 -0500 (EST)
From: rbeaudette@state.ma.us
Subject: Q-chip, spoiler, fogs
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Status: RO

Hey, that not hard.  I finally got around to putting in my Q-chip.  It's 
about time, I've only had it for four weeks.  For anyone thinking about doing 
it yourself, like everyone says, it is not too hard.  A rubber mallet helps 
to "urge" the air intake housing and brainbox to move.  

I've put 160 miles on the chip, mostly highway.  The power seems to be 
slightly better, not as significant as I thought it would be (tough to judge 
without measuring).  Acceleration in the low rpms is not too noticably 
quicker.  All in all, I can't say for sure that even at $105 it was worth the 
price.  Fuel economy seems to be suffering, but I will wait for a few more 
long trips to make sure.  This is my first experience with chipping a car, so 
I am not sure what I should have expected.  Although I am aware the VR6 is 
not as amenable to chipping as the other engines in VW's lineup.

I also took the time to change my spoiler speed.  Thanks to those who rumaged 
through the dash to find the right module and resistor.

Matthew who just go new fogs:  Kindly keep updating the list on the longevity 
of your new fogs.  If these last, I will finally replace my cracked but 
functioning fogs.

Cheers

Roland
93 VR6

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Jan 29 22:41 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 01:36:23 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: AMS 3.0L VR6
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Status: RO

VR6 conversion.  In brief, this is an AMS 3.0L project courtesy of the ABT
crankshaft with modified pistons. Throw in a VW Motorsports VSR inlet
manifold, ABT 268 cams and heavy-duty valve springs, Techtonics ported,
polished & flowed head (to which the VSR is match ported to),
custom-programmed AMS chip, Neuspeed throttle body, ABT headers & rear
muffler, Sachs sports clutch, Quaiffe differential, 225/40ZR16 SP8000,
Neuspeed Sports Springs , Bilstein Sports shocks, Neuspeed anti-sway bar &
upper strut tie-bar, and you have a very impressive car!  

   Preliminary dyno figures are 240 engine hp @ 5500rpm after only 100 miles,
more is expected after the break-in period and fine-tuning on the dyno. Like
me, the owner of this car does not want to come out with any unverified
claims of monster power gains, and also wants a relatively unsouped-up
appearance. He's currently subscribed to the list and  will probably post
some details once more objective measurements are available (or I'll pass on
the info, with his permission).

Cheers,
Edward

1992 Black 3104cc VR6

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Feb  1 22:16 PST 1996
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Date: Fri, 02 Feb 1996 00:14:54 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Turbo VR6s and EIP's 3.1
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making good progress with their turbo VR6 project, great!  However, I believe
RPI has some way to go before we'll get to see their twin-turbo 3.1 terror on
the road. Oh well. And how's the ND turbo 2.8 coming along, Tim? Should be
exciting when this muscle-bound generation of forced induction VR6 are
finally in production...maybe I should "upgrade" mine?   Just joking, I'm
broke enough as it is!!!  

   Anyway, I think I'll have enough power to bask in for a little while
(heehee!), looks like our design objectives of well-distributed power,
stealth, and relative streetability may have mostly been achieved in this
3.1, guess we'll find out after next week's dyno runs. A fat and useful
powerband is what I'm really hoping for, rather than a peaky max hp at some
ridiculously high rpm range (even if the latter looks more impressive when it
comes to bragging rights!). This mild-looking VR6 may not be a mean
quarter-mile or traffic-lights machine, but I think it'll surprise a few
people...  ;o)

Cheers,
Edward

1992 Black 3104cc Sleeper VR6
 
****************************************************************
<< Hi Edward !  Pleased to hear from you. Just to let you know we reserved
dyno time in three weeks!  So I''ll let you know how the 3.1 turns out then.
  Oh, also along with our turbocharged Jetta GLX, utilizing a Garret TO4, a
Skyline Gtr Intercooler, Greddy external wastegate, Trust Rebic3 fuel control
computer along with their Simulator, a 3 inch exhaust from the turbo back
emptying into a Borla XR1, along with the Quaiffe and Sachs 4puck clutch and
alum.alloy lightweight pressure plate etc. etc. etc. How we lowered the
compression ratio will remain confidential at this time.  Guesstimating Hp.
figures should be well over 300!!!!!                       

    I'll definitely keep you posted...
        Ciao, 
           George      >>
****************************************************************





From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Feb  5 22:28 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 01:23:40 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: ABT 3.1 upgrade
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: corrado-l@teleport.com
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>Don't quote my exact figures (I
>don't have the magazine here in front of me), but for around 
>$4500 - $5000 (maybe more!), ABT modifications will "modestly" 
>bump horsepower up to 260 with an accompanying 0-60 time in 
>the 5.5 to 5.7 second range.
>
>	Yan (93 SLC)


    As a reference, here are some advertised prices from EC for the 3.1 VR6
kits:
RPI  -   ABT 3.1 kit,     $5950
EIP  - Custom 3.1 kit,  $4899
(Note that EIP's 3.1 is somewhat different from the regular ABT 3.1 in that
the former uses larger 83mm forged & thermal-barrier coated pistons with a
higher compression ratio of 11:1, compared to ABT's 82mm pistons and 10.8:1
compression. Both incorporate the ABT 95.6mm longer-stroke forged
crankshaft).

   Thus far, I'm not aware of any verifiable road hp dyno figures published
for the ABT 3.1 kit in the US. There have however been a few claims and
estimates that seem to range from 240 engine hp upwards (the most common ones
being 250-260hp). Note that these 3.1 engines had additional performance
parts installed, such as a modified chip programme, P-Flow, ported throttle
bodies, the VSR, wilder cams, flowed & polished VR6 cylinder heads, headers,
performance exhausts, etc.  These mods would contribute some of the extra
power reported and also bump up the costs of the 3.1 conversion by a
significant amount! 

Cheers,
Edward

1992 Black 3104cc Sleeper VR6

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Feb  5 20:47 PST 1996
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Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 23:42:46 -0500
From: CorradoVR6@aol.com
Subject: jacking, speed calcs,3.1 litre prices
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RE:
>6) I need to rotate my tires.  I have a floor jack and two jack stands.  I
>know this might seem silly, but how do I do it?  Rather, what is the safe
>way to do it?  It doesn't seem to stable to me to jack up one side of the
>car in both the front and the back, but I could be wrong.

When I rotate my tires, I jack up the rear axle with a hydraulic jack placed
directly in the middle of the rear axle, that way both rear wheels lift up.
Then I place a jackstand at each end of the axle.  That gets both rear wheels
in the air and frees up the jack to lift up one front tire at a time and
rotate that particular side's wheels.

Regarding the person who asked about the EIP 3.1 litre prices, I asked them
for info, and here's what you get:
11:1 lightweight forged alloy pistons with 2 High performance coatings
ABT 95.6mm forged crank,Total Seal ring pack, spiral lock clips, Raceware rod
bolt set, Rod bearing set, maing bearing set, lower gasket set. for $4899.
Options are Raceware main stud kit which is recommended to increase strength
of crank position and reduces wear, $169.  Also Raceware head stud kit,
recommended motor options, to greatly increase clamping pressure of cylinder
head and reduces possibility of gasket failure $199. Also Complete upper
gasket set, i.e. head gasket, oil seals, exhaust gaskets, intake gaskets,
valve cover gasket, etc. $229.
3.0 litre kit is similar for $2399

Now, regarding the speed calculations posted earlier taking into account the
engine RPM, the final drive ratio, and the wheel circumference I don't get
the same results at all. I used a stopwatch a GPS and the friendly
neighboorhood radar trailor to determine that at, say 3500 RPM, my OEM tire
sized SLC goes  75.3 MPH, and at 4000 R's it goes 86.1, and at 4500 it goes
96.1 and not 78, 90, and 101 respectively as calculated in a previous posting
for the US SLC with 205/50/15 tires.  What gives?  Incidentally, I determined
that in 5th gear, I can multiply the RPM's by 2.1535885 X 10 -2 to get an
accurate speed.

Just thought I'd put in my $.02

Rog.



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Wed Jan 10 00:13 PST 1996
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Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 02:25:51 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: EC article on Rally's 3.1 Corrado
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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    OK, folks, I've just received the latest clarification from George of
Rally Motorsports about those 2 questions that have been put forward about
the EC article on Rally's 3.1.
The revelation that a 0.76 ratio 5th gear and larger diameter tires were used
would account somewhat for this higher top speed (Karl, care to do another
calculation based on the figures below to verify/dispute this?)... Here it
is: 
           
<< Hi, Ed. I'm really happy that there was so much interest in the 3.1 in the
FEB issue
of EC.  I've read these questions that seem to be nagging some people's
minds, so 
here I am prepared to answer them .

 1)  To describe the torquey feel of the car would be quite hard, meaning
that the motor had only 50 miles on it when Peter Wu and I took it out for
its debut.  So everything
is quite tight in there .  After all the dyno did state 256hp @ 6200rpm and
254 lbs/ft @
6000rpm (Dynojet chassis dynometer).  I' m sure if you drove the car you
would notice the difference!  Despite the wide tires, how many Corrados or
shall I say VR6s do you know where in 1st & 2nd gears the steering wheel
wants to tear out of your hands? I bet very, very few!  And that's just not
from gearing alone!  

Which moves us onto the second question.
2)  When you do computerized gear charts, a lot of things have to go into the
equation
to make them almost accurate (within 5 to 10 mph).  Tire size for instance -
a GSD
225/35-17 is equal to a 23.2 inch diameter. A stock tire diameter is 29.8.
 Fifth gear was also changed to 0.76.  We expect a lot more from this vehicle
as it progressively
breaks in!!!!!!!!!!!!!

George  >>



From corrado-l-owner@teleport.com Tue Jan  9 19:52 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 09 Jan 1996 20:56:49 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: EC article on Rally's 3.1 Corrado
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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   Spoke briefly with George from Rally today, and his explanation was that
the EC article was inaccurate, that if anything the Rally ABT 3.1 experienced
a gain rather than a loss in low-end torque especially since its head did not
featured bigger valves...  Did not get a chance to ask about the
speed/gearing question though.

   Anyway, he plans to join the Corrado list soon, so it may get interesting
(entertaining?!) with 3 major tuners on-line... I think his email address is
"RallyMsrpt@aol.com", or something like that.

   Well, this is not meant to be a plug for any tuner by the way, I hope that
whoever joins the list will contribute their advice and opinions primarily as
VW enthusiasts rather than indulging in political back-stabbing...  ;o)

Edward


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Feb  7 10:36 PST 1996
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Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 13:04:45 +0000
From: cgade@hallam.com
Subject: Improved Throttle Body!
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     I'd like to relay an experience I had dealing with a fellow C fanatic, 
     Brian Jowett.  About a month ago he offered to improve my C's T-body 
     by removing the restrictive step.  I liked his honest approach, he 
     knew the reason the step was there and why people, like me, like to 
     have it removed.
     
     I drove 3.5 hours from Vermont to get the job done, and ended up 
     having him step me through it--bonus!  Brian has all the tools, 
     experience and patience for me to do it in 90 minutes.
     
     The car is now more snappy and seems to reach the redline faster.  I 
     also learned bunches about the C and got to drool over his Flash Red 
     C.  Brian is definitely a cool guy with a girlfriend who puts up with 
     us VW geeks and a very friendly huge dog.  Thanks, Bri, and don't sell 
     your C for a Synchro...
     
     Chris
     Vermont
     93 SLC Inproved T-Body!, 5 brake lights, Pflo
     

From UniqueVR6@aol.com Fri Feb  9 01:05 PST 1996
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Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 03:58:59 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: Get-togethers?
To: Marisa9413@aol.com, jan@UG.EDS.COM, char@netvoyage.net,
        BKXPSC@tevm2.nsc.com, oconnelc@halsp.hitachi.com, karl@advansys.com,
        wilfred@sfsu.edu, kafka@cats.ucsc.edu, wkgee@ucdavis.edu,
        radog60@ix.netcom.com
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<< yeah lets get together............Bay area and LA >>

<>

<>
**************************************************************

   Sounds good, I'll try to update you all on my final plans, hopefully
before I leave for the East Coast, if not, then after I return to California
(will be without email for 2 weeks starting Thurs, 2/15, which is when I fly
to New York)...  Oh, here's a teaser recently sent to me:

Cheers,
Edward

******************************************************************************
************************
Hey, Ed what's up.  I finally got to see what your car could do today.  Steve
took me for a ride a few miles down the road and let me drive it back (I hope
that you don't mind - I take extremely good care of my car and do the same to
others).  I must say that I am impressed!  The power delivery is smoother
than stock, giving the car a false sense of acceleration. By that I mean that
you don't experience a sudden surge or flat spot in power at any point, just
smooth delivery at all rpms due to the super linear powerband. 

When Steve was accelerating at one point I wasn't too impressed at first
because I thought we were in second, until I found out we were in third.
 40-60mph in second gear is probably the strongest surge of power in a
"normal" VR6, in my opinion it is the most impressive way to show off a
Corrado.  Well, your car has the same pull in third as my car (P-chip,
P-flow, throttle body) in second at that rpm range. 

The idle is not quite as smooth as a car without aftermarket cams, but unless
you are really familiar with how smooth a VR6 is, the 268 cams would go
unnoticed. The exhaust is as "stealth-sounding" as stock also. It is deeper
in frequency than stock, but nowhere near as loud as a car equiped with a
P-flow.  I did not get to do any top speed runs, but up until 80 mph the car
is sick! 

I believe the story about the M3.  The driveability is more impressive than
stock, your 3.1 is definitely faster than a stock or modified 2.8.   Also I
think you can expect about 20 more horsepower after the EIP manifold, chip,
and TB are installed.  It is an M3 with the body of a Corrado...

Love it,   ED F.
******************************************************************************
************************

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Feb 14 17:33 PST 1996
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Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 18:23:38 -0500
From: The Only True Corrado 
Subject: Oettinger 3.1, PIAA 1200/1000, Euro Lights, Suko cams, Euro 2.9.
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Status: RO

Hi everybody!!

This post is for all, but the first part is mostly for UniqueVR6 
(Edward) and the others who want to know about Oettinger 3.1...

		This post contains updates and infos


Ok, here's the infos (and updates) :

	I've called GTA 2min ago (well, now it's more than 2min, cuz it 
takes me time to write down this msg)... ;-)

Euro Lights : NO EURO LIGHTS AT GTA! B.O. too! I was the 4th guy who 
called TODAY for Euro lights... for Cs, of course... When I asked him if 
he have Euro lights, he laughed a bit, and I said, "What?", he said 
"Your the 4th person who call for the same part today."... "Ah!", I 
said... so no European lights till 4 weeks... Do someone wants to oder 
anyway? About $400-430US, I think... Phone number is : 1-514-443-4500.


Oettinger 3.1 : NO!!! Oettinger NEVER produced a 3.1 kit... They sell 
the special kit for the 2.8, which puts out about 240hp at higher revs, 
but NO 3.1 ; only ABT and EIP has... (maybe others are, but the most 
known are EIP and ABT, to my knowlegde)...


Suko cams : I don't know if it's an update, but I've never read, in the 
past, something positive/interesting about Suko cams ; but here is :
	GTA told me that Sukos are great, cuz hallow and light... "Yes, 
but are they brittle, weak?", I said... he replyed "No they are not, 
they had been tested severely and passed the tests ; they are as solid 
as rock (I'm extrapoling a bit what he said), like other males, uh, 
oups, MAKES." He already did couple of mods with Sukos on Cs and the 
clients are 100% satisfied... They don't want to sell something that 
don't worth the price (depending on some conditions and the what you 
want)... except if you insists...


PIAA 1000/1200 : Maybe it's not a good choice to buy the new 1200 from 
PIAA... Cuz they are less solid, more weak than the others (1000, 900, 
etc)... Simply cuz they are NOT made of iron like it's predecessors... 
This is cuz PIAA wants to reduce the price of their lamps... So maybe 
the 1000 is a better choice than the new 1200... (especially here in 
Quebec, where rocks and salt is abundant in winter, even if I just go 
out less than an 1h/week in winter with my C!)


Euro 2.9 engine (the one on the VR6s synchro) : GTA told me that the 
Euro 2.9 is a great (he almost tried to say : a must) choice for those 
who wants to have a 3.0+ engine. Cuz the walls on the normal 2.8 are 
thiner than the ones on the 2.9 (BTW, this 2.9 produces a bit more than 
190hp, and of course, has better torque), and that means that if you 
enlarge, make bigger the pistons, those (pistons) will probably heat and 
overheat the block (the engine) of the normal 2.8 (which has been 
upgraded to a 3.0+, don't forget)...
	GTA said that in Quebec, you must pay attention of those 
possible overheating probs... It could seriously affect the engine 
(talking about a 2.8 boosted up to 3.0+)... Also (and that I really 
dislike what he said), he said that revving the engine too high, like 
8000-8500, often, could, with the 2.8 walls, cuz the overheat... I don't 
know if he's 100% right, but I'm sure that it's partly true.... I DON'T 
WANT TO DISCOURAGE C OWNERS TO UPGRADE THEIR 2.8 UP TO A 3.0 OR 
3.1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm not saying that... I'm just saying that you 
must pay attention to that, and take care of it... You must know what to 
do, and what NOT to do (does someone had tested a 3.0+ at the max and 
NEVER experiented overheating probs? Maybe, surely!, that's why I don't 
think it's 100% true).
	GTA said that they stopped the rpm of their 2.9 (cuz their 
produces 2.9) at 6800, cuz they want to keep a margin, cuz they heavily 
guarantee their "engines"... And they also said (not of interest for 
those who don't want to have affairs with GTA) that they don't really 
want to install their competitors parts on a car they will maintain 
after... That sucks, cuz I'll have to revise the mods I wanted to buy 
from US tuners... (EIP, ND, etc...) They said they will do install, but 
not engines..., well, not a complete engine... sucks me, really... I can 
buy almost everything, but if I'm buying 100% from their competitors, 
(mostly EIP, snif!! ;-(), they wouldn't appreciate to install the stuff 
and maintain the car.

	He said that if you don't want to have a 2.9, but you want to 
have a really tough engine, you could buy titanium connecting rods, 
instead... which are very expensive... I know one car who came with 
titanium con rods, and it's the Super Great Porsche 959, and I'm sure 
every of you guys have one!! ;-)

	Anyway, at the end, the max "streetable" hp (dyno figures) their 
2.9 (with VSR and all the blahblah) can make is between 250-270 
(estimated 260) after it breaks in (almost the max power for a street 
2.9. For race, it's about 350hp!)...
	BTW, he suprised me when he said that he didn't want to sell me 
the Neuspeed P-flow, I have to precise, ONLY the Neuspeed P-flow... I 
said "Why?", he said that "ONLY the P-flow does nothing, except sound... 
If you want to have sound, ok, buy it, or else, you'll buy it for 
nothing..." I was suprised of is, uh, "thoughts"... I said "No, it's cuz 
I'll make bigger mods this summer and changing the air box is something 
that I'll anyway do sometime, so I said to myself : let's do it 
earlier..." He answered "Ok, I understand, you can buy one, but if you 
don't have the will to make other mods later, except sound, the p-flow 
will give you nothing..." Strange way of thinking, but honest he was, 
like any other tuners I've heard from (EIP, ND, etc...), I have to say 
that...!

	They heavily guarantee all their work and products... They don't 
want their client to have probs, that's why they keep margin, and 
rejects mods that has higher POSSIBILITIES to have probs... except if 
you insists... They also said that if you buy all from GTA (I didn't 
said GTA's parts, but buying parts FROM GTA, no matters if it's ABT, ND 
or others parts), they will shorten in time, and you can get out with a 
bill of $9000CAN ($6521.74US EXACTLY, cuz the exchange rate is 1.3800 
today) for something that should've cost you $12 000CAN ($8695.65US).

	I'll have to revise all over the mods I wanted to do... shit, 
I'm getting crazy for all the time I'm passing on gathering infos each 
day (maybe I'm already crazy...!) ;-) and trying to find the best mod 
for me... Anyway, I don't have the choice, cuz they're the only one 
around here who can maintain correctly my car...


Anyway, that's it, and that's the news he told me... Maybe you don't 
agree (feel free to tell me if yes and why) or maybe you do agree (feel 
free to tell me if no and why)...

Myself, I don't know if I agree or not... I'll wait for your answers... 
But one thing is sure : Quebec is a rough place for cars... better have 
a tough engine that will last long...


The discussion with GTA removed me the smile I had before I called.... 
;-(


Frank
with a big mess in my brain...

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Feb 20 03:39 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 04:44:17 -0500 (EST)
From: komosa@ibm.net (Mark Komosa)
Subject: Ignition coils, Q-chip K&N Autolite Platinums,VR6 vs Musta
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(There is more in here than the subject line could fit, like curing
chirping dashes, 
backfiring seeming to go away with new chip, at the bottom of the
post..
This mail is like my personal digest!)

Hi All, 

Haven't posted in a while, so I'll sum up all my recent experiences
all at once, and
maybe somebody will find worth while to read, if at multiple
readings...

My C, seems like this is the preferred way to refer to them lately...,
went into
the dealer for a new ignition coil a couple of weeks back, it felt
like it wasn't firing
all cylinders, just squeezed it under 24k waranty. I did get the
Master Guard platinum plan as well (84 months/100K miles $0 deductible
 for $1045). I
was disappointed to see that window mechanism is not covered, though
the sun roof
is not excluded, and it's beginning to pop.... (jaws music...)

Anyway, the dealer recommended the 30K tune up, since my car has been
on the
road since 2/94 (93 SLC), it was time. I believe they wanted $217 for
it. Of course, I
politely declined and started planning the Great Tune up. Froze my
butt off nicely
in this process, this was during the worst cold spell this winter!

Ordered the Q-chip, couldn't resist the price, and K&N, tracked down
the Autolite 
$.99 plugs at a local store, but went with the more expensive platinum

version. 

Did the chip first, not before doing some timed runs/roll-ons.
The first time one does something it's usually hell, but this chip
swap can be done in
15-20 minutes  the next time. 

The biggest problem that took me an ungodly amount of time is to
figure out how to 
take that bloody circlip that holds the fresh air intake in place. The
only way it will 
come out is if you push on it , behind the peg with one screwdriver,
while pulling it 
out towards the outside with another. This will make sense if you look
at it.  Once 
that box was out, it's a snap.

Putting that circlip back on is also a bit tricky since there is
little 
space to put your hand in there to slide the circlip into the rails of
the intake box
once you put the box completely in place.  I inserted the clip lightly
into the 
rails with the box partially lifted out, then placed the box
completely in , and all
that remains to do is to push the clip all the way with a screwdriver.


The car started with no problems. I blipped it a few times , and I
could tell
a difference in the sound, and how fast the needle went around the
tach.
It's sounded a lot more determined, the stock seems a bit lethargic in
comparison.

The air box was next, boy it's a pain!  I was able to undo does clips
which split the
box  in two and took out the filter.  I took out and cleaned the
intake mesh, 
it was pretty clogged.  I tried to look around for the infamous
snorkel, but wasn't 
sure what it was.  Now the fun started when I tried to put it back
together.

The K&N filter's rubber frame is not molded the same as the stock and
the filter can 
slide around if you put it on the top of the air box. I ended up
putting the filter into
the lid first, which is a snug fit, before trying to close the whole
thing up.
That worried me at first since the box the filter came in said it was
for a A2 GTI,
but on the other side it said it was for a V6, still it's not as nice
fit as the original.

Now, someone at some time mentioned that the best way to deal with
clips holding 
the box together, is to remove the box out of the car totally. I tried
that, and there
seemed to be no way that a completely assembled box can go back into
it's cavity
with that aluminum/rubber hose running along the fender. 

I took it apart again, put the bottom half back in, then I sqeezed in
the lid and 
closed the clips, with lots of pain, swearing, and manuvering of the
box,  
But it was done!

Next day went to repeat the runs/roll-ons.  Very dissapointed. I did
not see any
improvement in the 4th and 5th 40-60mph roll-ons. The 0-60 times I
can't trust
since I was getting a lot of tire spin with the winter tires, plus
it's like -40F out in
Chicago.  The only difference was the responsiveness/sound of the
engine.  
And I really wasn't sure I want to have a more strained engine for no
gains in
performance. Serious thoughts about returning the chip.

Then came the surprising part, the new plugs went in (don't try this
without your
10" extension, spark plug socket, and I hope you'll will have a better
way to 
reattach the wires than I did.).  

The engine just seemed to come alive, I could tell just from blipping
the throttle,
the needle went around like mad. Then I drove out, it was a bit damp,
I new something had changed because I was spinning the fronts in a
situation 
where before that would not happen.  

I must say that the 4th 40-60mph didn't change much at all,
(was 6.67 is 6.45 this is just some stop watch timings, different days
and conditions)
I don't remeber what the rpm is at 60mph in 4th, but I think it's
right before the fun
starts, around 4K and up, so it's not too surprising.

But I believe that the 0-60 will be different, if I could actually put
that power to the ground.  
Have to wait till spring and the Intermediates to be on.

Inaccurate timings aside, the car has been transformed.  It revs
faster, seems to
be stronger , especially over 4K, at redline it doesn't seem to be
straining at all,
just producing a nice determined, tuned sound,  sort of like a sport
bike, and if you think the stock VR6 sounds mean, this is like a VR6
on steroids. 

And then I found a Mustang.  I got his attention, he snuck up behind
me, this is
around 60-70mph, he might have been trying to draft me, he jumped out
and was
trying to take me, I of course let the C loose, and he just came back
in behind me.
Im not sure why.  I let him catch up and now parallel, he tried to
take me a couple
more times, couldn't do it.  The last run I let him catch up, get
ahead of me about 
car length before I let it loose again. I downshifted to 3rd , that
put me at about 5k 
rpm, and I started to gain on him, after the shift to 4th the rate of
gain increased, 
then I overtook him and kept pulling away , we hit triple digits.  

Now, I wasn't blowing his doors off but I gained on a 95-96 GT 
after letting him go first. So that's something for a 2.8l!       

Speaking of backfiring while blipping the throttle... I have put the
stock chip
back in and blipped the throttle a few times, I get the backfiring
that people are
talking about.  With the Q-chip, the backfiring  is non-existant to
nil, no answer
just an observation.  

So as you can tell I'm pretty happy with the result of these mods.  I
was 
really surprised by the change the spark plugs made. The old ones
didn't seem 
to be in bad shape, they were the NGK with dual electrodes.  Either
these 
Autolites are something really neat, or it was just replacing an aging
plug with 
something new that made the difference.

The only caveat is the gas mileage. I don't know how some peple say
that
their highway mileage goes up with their chips.  Mine is stuck at
22mpg on the 
highway. Maybe there is still something wrong with my car, since my
mileage was 
shit for a month or two before the iginition coil totally went, and I
haven't driven 
long enough on the stock chip after the dealer visit to know if it had
returned to the
orginal 25+mpg. 

 Maybe the cold has something to do with it as well. How about the
filter? Will that increase fuel consumption?  It can't be all my right
foot! 
But even if it's the chip, I'm keeping it there. Maybe I'll put the
stock back in some
time.  

I did the oil&filter as well, got to do the brake fluid job. I got a
Mighty-Vac 
at the Track&Auto, I think it was on sale for $25.00. Should be no big
deal, right?
Im sure it'll be fun, just like anything else the first time on a new
machine.

Went to the Chicago auto show last weekend, the first thing I get in
my hand
is a flyer from the local SCCA club. Guess what, I signed up for the
two day
school for Solo II. Now Im thinking wider pedals and 4 point harness. 

I was able to find Bondurant book on driving , but I have seen somebod
y post
a title of a book specific to autocross, but I must have deleted that
mail.
Does anyone know what it is?  Bob doesn't seem to like front wheel
drive cars.
He devotes a whole lot more space to his achievements in the racing
world than
to this topic.    

One more thing, if you have read this far... im impressed.  
The squeek, or chirp that alf@teleport is complaining about from his 
dashboard sounds alot like the chirp I had in mine.

While playing with the chip, I found the bolts that hold the dash to
the 
body. This was  a tip from another list member. But maybe it should be
repeated.
 
How to find them bolts: 

Look at the windshield, there is a plastic strip running along the
bottom of the wind
shield.  It's divided into three pieces. Two short, on the sides, and
longer one in the
middle. There is a bolt pretty much directly under each of these
joints reachable from the area where the ECU and the wiper motor is
located. You will have to feel
for them, they are not visible.
I think they are 10mm nuts. 

(I didn't acutally find the right hand one, but the Bentley displays
two symmetrically placed bolts.  The right one I couldn't get to
because of the wiper mechanism. Heaven help whoever needs to get at
it, tell me how you did it afterwards. 
Luckily my driver side is quiet , but for how long..)

The left bolt is just to the left of the ECU box, and below that joint
described above.
Put your hand in the, don't know what to call this, cavity and reach
upwards with
your hand, you should feel a bolt with a nut, possibly no nut just a
bolt if it totally
came off.
(Mine was totally loose, after tightening no more chirps) 

I know how annoying that chirp is, I was sooooooooo glad to have found
it.
There are also two bolts that actually hold the dash itself to a
bracket
which we just tightened to the body, above. But I figure you need to
take the
glove box out to get at the left hand side, and the instrument cluster
for the
right (looking from the front of the car). But this is pure
speculation. I might
do that if there is any additional noises from the dash.  

Any cures for the squeeking Cpillar plastics?

Alright, I hope some of this proves usefull to somebody. 

Mark





Mark Komosa             
komosa@ibm.net         93 SLC	 


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Feb 22 07:36 PST 1996
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Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 10:20:01 -0500 (EST)
From: Samuel Chung-Ky Lee 
Subject: Edward's 3.1 l
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To all that have been following Edwards EIP 3.1 l with interest...I am 
happy to report that his car is nothing short of a wet dream. 
Edward...I'm sorry you had difficulties with your airline schedule and it 
prevented us from meeting.  Jason Livingood, myself, and a couple of guys 
from PA (sorry guys I already forgot your names...though I remember Hoover 
was a last name) made the pilgrimage to EIP in Maryland to meet Edward, 
the guys at EIP and the 3.1 L.  

The 3.1 L outfitted with 17" Hockenheim wheels with rubberbands for tires 
and EIP lettering is the only give a way that something special may be up 
with the car...then you look a little closer and see the cross drilled 
rotors, monster brake calipers, smoked lenses and eurospec lights, and 
chrome tailpipe...then your suspicions about this car get a bit 
stronger.  Pop the hood the beautiful red Neuspeed plug wires stand out 
and so does the polished EIP manifold and p-flow like filter conversion 
(Authority?)...From here I'm in complete awe and will not be able to 
describe all the technical features with any justice and will defer that 
to Rich and Edward.

After washing and polishing Steve of EIP literally took off down the road 
for a test run spinning through the first 3 gears (with the short shift 
kit) becoming not but a blur on the horizon.  After dinner and many hours 
of waiting for Edward, we gave up our vigil for a much anticipated ride 
in the car.  The eurolights practically turned night into day and with 
three people in the car and Steve at the wheel 0-80 came at a couple of 
blinks of the eyes.  The car is tight, well behaved and faster than 
HELL!  Narry a hint of body or tire roll on the back twisting roads...a 
ride that unfortunately makes me want to pull out all the credit cards 
(and apply for more) and max them out on the quality work that EIP 
performs.  Rich,  I know this is a plug for you guys...but I think a well 
deserved one.  Keep up the good work.

Edward...sorry I couldn't stay longer to meet you. I really wanted to see 
the expression on your face when you arrived to see your then stock C 
fully transformed.  I will look forward to seeing it in EC!  As for your 
cross country drive ahead of you...God Speed and be safe!  You and your 
car will remain a legend in my mind.
Sam Lee
University of Delaware
'92 SLC...humbly stock...stereo upgrades still in progress

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat Feb 24 14:43 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 24 Feb 1996 17:36:09 -0500
From: Eric Hoover 
Subject: EIP's 3.1 beast
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After being one of the few people to have experienced EIP's 3.1 car, I =
thought I'd share my impressions.  I just wish I could have stayed =
around long enough to see Ed's reaction to what was about 3 months ago a =
bone stock Corrado.=20

The first impression when you see it is WOW!  The 17" MSW 55's on the =
black beast look great.  It was lowered with ABT springs and Bilstein =
shocks.  The ride was so comfortable, you'd swear you were in a stock C. =
 That is until the corners come, the Euro headlights turn the night into =
day, and the roar of the P-flo-like filter and ABT exhaust sing their =
sweet song !   I can only imagine how the car feels when driving it =
alone !  (There was 3 of us in it for the thrill ride)  Other mod's =
included a very wide chrome Eibach front stress bar, Neuspeed short =
shift kit, white gauge faces, tinted tailights (EIP does them), drilled =
rotors all around, and bigger calipers up front.

I am assuming everyone already knows about the engine package:  custom =
EIP light forged alloy pistons, ABT forged crankshaft, EIP's reworked =
big valve cylinder head, EIP's reworked intake manifold, EIP's high flow =
throttle body, EIP's high flow exhaust manifold and downpipe, and EIP's =
lightened flywheel.  There's probably even more EIP stuff that I forgot =
(sorry Rich!)

The car was put on the dyno and measured 258 hp at the wheels !!  I =
guess it's time to start playing the lottery again !


Eric Hoover ('93 SLC)

PS.  Sorry Rich if all my facts aren't all straight - I've been having =
trouble sleeping since Wednesday!



From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Feb 26 10:59 PST 1996
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Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 14:09:25 -0800 (PST)
From: Mike Corrado 
Subject: NOS/Emissions & the 268
In-Reply-To: <199602240807.AAA13200@desiree.teleport.com>
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For the person who asked about the emissions concerning the schrick 268 
cams for the VR, yes they will pass emissions, and no they don't idle bad.
I have had 2 emission tests done on my car. One at Neuspeed where arron 
remove the EGr valve(tube in the exhaust manifold.),and thus measured 
pre-cat emissons, adn he said I would pass California emissions without a 
problem, and my second test was done here in vegas, and I pass with what 
the guy said was and exceptionally clean test result. 
As one who hangs out with a lot of the honda squeeze guys, I can tell you 
for a fact that it is easy with a simple 80shot to get a honda into the 
mid 13's. I would estimate that a direct port on a VR6 jetted for 
120shot, would drop the car into the high 12's/ low 13's. 
I base this on my freinds 1995 M3 who ran a progressive 120shot and 
pulled  a 12.87. I belive that with slicks or some sticky tires a VR 
would be very close to that time especially if it was a Direct port, and 
not a wet system like the guy with the M.. so there is my two cents.. later
Mike
95 Gti
 

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Feb 27 19:34 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 22:29:39 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: * Official 3.1 Dyno figures *
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   Well, for those of you who have expressed an interest in my project car,
I'm back in California from the cross-country journey!  First of all, I would
like to apologise to Sam, Jason, Rob, Eric, and the half-dozen enthusiasts
from the list who made the extra effort to come all the way down to Maryland
and were patient enough to wait (in vain) for me. I wasted a WHOLE day at JFK
airport waiting by the gate for my virtual flight (and subsequent phantom
replacements) which never materialised, and had to go through the entire
charade the first half of the next day at LaGuardia - finally ended up taking
Amtrak...an extremely frustrating experience, I must say.

    But I was happy to hear that most of you did get an opportunity to sit in
the car for a short while and at least get an inkling of what a conversion of
this nature can do to an already excellently-engineered engine & chassis.
 Actually, I sort of wish you could all have had an opportunity to actually
drive the car itself, as being a passenger doesn't really begin to convey the
extent of the quite INCREDIBLE experience awaiting you behind the wheels... 

    From my various postings to the list in the past, you may have sensed my
propensity to evaluate most things in a fairly rational, logical, and
objective manner, but this time I'm afraid I may have to succumb (temporarily
of course!) to pure, unadulterated & unbridled lust and passion - EIP's
rendition of the 3.1 has exceeded even my jaded expectations, in both
performance and driveability!!!   In fact, I'm surprised that Rich, Steve,
Drew and the EIP crew have been so controlled and modest in their
presentation of this more than successfully completed 3.1 project, unlike
some of the  fanfare that have preceded a number of other impressive
conversions based on the Abt 3.x kits...

    Well, let me try to recollect my thoughts before sharing my experience of
the transformed C. and the cross-country drive - I also have to take care of
work stuff that have piled up since my absence, plus catching up with tons of
email, of course.  Meanwhile, I'm posting the dyno figures for the 3.1 as
promised:

***************************************************************************
EIP Tuning 3.1 Litre VR6 (1992 Corrado) 
------------------------------------

Date of Dyno:     2/20/96 
Location   :        AutoThority Performance Engineering
                        Fairfax, Virginia, USA
Dyno Type:        Dual Roller Hydro-Kinetic (Clayton Chassis?)
Ambient Temp:   60-65 F 
Humidity:           High   

***************************************************************************
FRONT WHEEL HORSEPOWER, road hp

RPM	Base	Manifold	Exhaust
-------	-------	------------	------------
1,500	  51	  51	  53
2,000	  72	  72	  73
2,500	  94	  94	  94
3,000	117	119	120
3,500	148	153	150
4,000	181	187	191
4,500	204	215	217
5,000	216	231	236
5,500	225	239	248
6,000	233	243	258
6,500	222	240	251
7,000	198	225	236

***************************************************************************
TORQUE, Lb-ft 

RPM	Base	Manifold	Exhaust
-------	-------	------------	------------				
1,500	180	180	184
2,000	191	189	193
2,500	198	197	197
3,000	206	208	210
3,500	222	229	225
4,000	238	245	251
4,500	238	251	253
5,000	227	228	248
5,500	215	228	237
6,000	204	213	226
6,500	180	194	203
7,000	149	169	177
***************************************************************************
NOTE:

Base = EIP 3.1 kit (EIP 83mm pistons & Abt 95.6mm crankshaft), Schrick 268
cams, EIP large intake-valve modified head, Abt 67mm exhaust system.  Intake
Manifold & Chip were factory stock.

Manifold = Base + EIP-modified Intake Manifold + AutoThority-tuned Chip

Exhaust = Manifold + EIP-modified Exhaust (modified downpipe & cat-less)

No claims are being made for the engine horsepower developed at the crank as
Rich had reminded me that these readings were after all made at the wheels,
not at the crank, and so any calculations would be based on estimates which
may not necessarily be accurate or would be prone to exaggeration...

However, for those interested, here's my own personal extrapolative
interpretation of the above measurements.  AutoThority have measured stock
2.8L Corrados in the 148-157 road hp range on their dynamometer.  Let's be
conservative and venture that if 157 road hp equates to 178 engine hp on
their chassis dyno, that would give us a 1.13 ratio.  Applying this to the
3.1's peak road hp of 258 @ 6000 rpm (253 lbs-ft torque @ 4500 rpm) would
deliver approx. 292.5 engine hp, quite an achievement for a 2-valve per
cylinder 3.1L V6! 

Put it this way, apparently the AutoThority dyno specialist could not believe
his initial readings as he was understandably skeptical that our humble VR6
would be capable of generating so much power, even though he had some
difficulties controlling the car on the rollers because of the massive torque
being delivered at the wheels.  But he was finally convinced after he tried
to disprove these results, and mentioned afterwards that the figures measured
were in the same league as their custom-modified BMW M3s (addition of
AutoThority chip, wilder cams, modified throttle-body & intake, etc. to bring
them up to European-spec M3s)...

Also New Dimensions has kindly agreed to put the 3.1 on their chassis dyno
sometime soon, so hopefully we'll have two independent measurements for
reference and comparison purposes.

Cheers,
Edward


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Feb 28 23:45 PST 1996
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Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 02:39:51 -0500 (EST)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: More cam stuff, smog results
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Well I've got to say that after putting nearly 1k miles on my C since the 
cam install, they are great. Very nice boost in torque. Wheel spin is 
much easier to coax, shifting into 3rd at 65 on a wet hill produced wheel 
spin, surprised me too. I find myself doing at least 5+mph faster on 
many of the longer straights around here. My first impression was 
definetly wrong, though I would not feel to good if I had paid full price 
for them. Enough.

I put the car on the exaust gas tester. The cams made a very small 
diference. The car originaly blew 0 HC, and 0 CO. Now it blows 0 HC, and 
the CO now flickers between .00 and .01. the limits are 220 and 4.00%. 
They really don't any difference. No need to worry. later

Brian 93 VR6 

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Feb 28 21:48 PST 1996
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Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 00:19:50 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: The 3.1 saga continues...
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Greetings all, I've been so swamped by work stuff since I got back th=
at I
apologise for not having an opportunity yet to update the list on the=
 EIP
3.1.  For those of you who are probably sick of hearing all this stuf=
f about
modified or non-stock Cs, this absence of reporting will surely be a =
welcome
relief, but for the rest, I'll try to post something informative by t=
he
weekend... =20

All I'll say for now is that the car is absolutely BRILLIANT, and eve=
r so
SWEET!!!  No overheating or idling and driveability problems during t=
he 3100
mile drive (with the motor running at fairly high rpms for up to 16 h=
ours at
a stretch, forced to run only on 90 Octane petrol in certain states),
contrary to speculation from certain quarters...   Wonderful piece of
execution and implementation there, Rich and the EIP crew!

Meanwhile, here's Don Tipton (my co-driver/passenger)'s reaction to t=
he 3.1,
unfortunately he has no access to his email account until he flies ba=
ck to NJ
next week so I'm posting this on his behalf:

Cheers,
Edward

P.S.  To Mark, Jeff, and Pete, you lads should be quite capable of ta=
king on
those brashy SE-Rs and the Caddy STS, but after hearing your stories,=
 am
almost tempted to slap a G60 badge on the 3.1 and lend it to you so t=
hat you
can teach those upstarts a lesson or two...  

*********************************************************************=
*********
***********************
Subj:=09Impressions of EIP 3.1 and X-Country Trek
Date:=0996-02-28=20
=46rom:=09Vreihen@aol.com (Don M. Tipton)

=91ello all=85

I=92m sure everyone is either anxiously waiting for more word on the =
3.1 or
completely disinterested in the whole project. To the latter, I hope =
this
post doesn=92t rouse or add to your impatience.

To introduce myself, I had the opportunity recently to share Edward=
=92s
cross-country drive from Maryland to California in his 3.1L VR6 Corra=
do.
Having already installed a VW Motorsports VSR in my own 1993 C. a lit=
tle
while ago (and soon to have Schrick 260 cams driving my valvetrain), =
I was
interested to see first-hand how this full-blown conversion would com=
pare to
my relatively modest modifications.=20

There have already been several posts focusing on dyno readings and a
discussion of the various mod options installed in this EIP 3.1, so I=
=92ll not
reiterate.  Anyway, figures only convey so much, when the real questi=
on is:
How does it FEEL?

Well, when I first started the 3.1 and revved the engine, the throaty=
 growl
was very satisfying=85 My leaden foot, combined with an ultra-light f=
lywheel,
wound the engine to 4500+ rpm before I could react! Once I=92ve accli=
mated to
the sports clutch & flywheel though, I found that the combination of =
mods
drew out the same reactions as does a stock C., just to more of an ex=
treme.
In other words, the car was very civilized and driveable when require=
d, even
with an extra 100+ hp on tap. At usual (read posted speed limit) spee=
ds, it
was very well-mannered, nearly indistinguishable from a stock C. in b=
oth ride
comfort & exhaust note.

The acceleration, however, is anything but stock=85 A tickle of the g=
as, hard
press on the brakes, or hard turn of the steering wheel can uncomfort=
ably
plaster your organs against any part of your rib cage! The motor alwa=
ys has
gobs of torque=85be it at only 2000rpm when I always used to downshif=
t, or
cruising leisurely at 85mph and effortlessly leaping to 120mph on dem=
and.
Once I found myself tearing into an exit ramp at double the rated spe=
ed
limit, but the Yoko AVS 215/40/17s showed no sign of complaining, and=
 the
Abt-Bilstein suspension kept the C. flat and under control.

The trip was fairly uneventful from a racing standpoint, we saw very =
few
performance cars on our trek until we entered California where we cam=
e across
a Porsche, Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4 and Volvo 850 Turbo. Oh, there was a=
n
"almost" encounter with a souped-up Mustang 5.0 in Alberqueque, and a
stock-looking red C. with European headlights tried to pass us on the=
 way to
Nashville, but I easily pulled away in 5th and he faded rapidly away =
at 90mph
(wonder if he=92s on the list?)=85

The most disturbing trait of the 3.1L was its effect on our personali=
ties,
myself especially. I=92m normally a rather passive driver, especially=
 on the
highway, but in the 3.1 I=92d find myself riding bumpers, curse and s=
tare down
everyone who thought 85 in the left lane was OK. Then again, when I f=
irst
bought my C., I was the same way!

Now I have to return to my newly-installed VSR Corrado, and I just ho=
pe that
after having driven the 3.1, I won=92t be too disappointed with what =
would
normally have been a major upgrade in performance for me. Looks like =
I can=92t
help but consider setting aside a 3.1L fund, though it would take qui=
te a
while for me to acumulate the necessary $$$ for such a complete proje=
ct! From
what I=92ve gathered so far though, EIP=92s 3.1 appears to generate c=
onsiderably
more power than the Abt 3.1 kit, and is quite a bit lower-priced than=
 many of
the other tuners=92 projects that we=92ve been reading about=85

I must warn anyone stopping by EIP, though: do so with plenty of mone=
y, even
when they offer such competitive discounts - I ended up quadrupling m=
y
original budget! And that=92s only for the next couple of weeks until=
 I can=92t
resist going back for more mods...=20

Well, after all this excitement, if anyone is interested in more mode=
st and
down-to-earth upgrades, I=92ll be posting my reactions to the VSR com=
bined with
Schrick 260s.

Enjoy,
Don
*********************************************************************=
*********
***********************


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Fri Mar  1 14:41 PST 1996
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Date: Fri, 01 Mar 1996 17:27:08 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: EIP 3.1 oil temps
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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>I don't remember seeing it posted so I'll ask,was the 3.1 built on a U.S
>2.8l or was it the European 2.9l?
>
>I remember a while back a thread going around about temps on both engines if
>they were modified.
>
>Billy Rose
>brose@ns.technonet.com


   Hello Billy and all,

   The EIP 3.1L conversion is built around a US-spec 2.8L VR6, though I'm
sure it could just as easily be done from a European 2.9L block if someone
had one available.  As for the temperature concerns understandably expressed
by some of you on the list, it hasn't been a problem at all thus far (keep my
fingers crossed) after 3,100 miles of spirited driving cross-country at 16
hour non-stop stretches, and sometimes being forced to run on 90 to 91
"premium" octane (yuk!) in parts of Oklahoma, New Mexico and Arizona. 

    The 11.1:1 compression ratio 3.1 engine naturally ran rougher and
perceptibly lost some power when running on this lower grade fuel, but did
not knock or ping audibly once even under load, thanks primarily to the
thermal-barrier coating EIP applied to the pistons, valves and ports, to
AutoThority's fine-tuning of the chip, and to the adaptability of the Bosch
Motronic engine-management system.

    Oil temp readings throughout the drive remained at 218 to 222F for a
sustained (i.e. hours at a time) 3000- 4000rpm, climbed to 230F for 4000-
5000rpm, and reached a max of 240F above 5k revs. Some of this can be
directly attributed to the installed New Dimensions oil cooler kit, and the
only occasion where I would consider going to a bigger oil cooler element (if
one was available, Tim?) would be if the car was taken to the track or I was
really flogging it in Death Valley on a hot summer day with the
air-conditioning at its max setting!  (Coolant temp was also surprisingly low
most of the time, hovering between one to two notches above the 160F mark.)

    Off the topic slightly, but the European headlights were so much superior
to the US versions in coverage and pattern that the difference was literally
night and day. Also be advised when considering 215-40/17 tyres on a lowered
car - your rear rubber will have a tendency to ocasionally rub on hitting bad
dips & bumps at speed when the car is loaded with rear passengers and/or
heavy luggage...

Cheers,
Edward
Who's currently wallowing in 7th heaven with his 3.1 uber-VR6 (it's so
sweet!!!), but living in dread of the inevitable appearance of his next
credit card statement, and to the unwelcome prospect of eking out a frugal
existence on borrowed credit for the next few years...

P.S.  Rich had mentioned there is a distinct possibility that my C. was one
of the very few 2.9L Corrados sold in California during 1992, judging from
its quite differently constructed intake manifold and other tell-tale signs. 
It is true that more than a few tuners had commented earlier that my
pre-conversion C. (basic Neuspeed mods only) appear to make noticeably more
power than other stock or mildly-modified Cs...so  perhaps I was sort of
"unique" even back in the pre-3.1 days?  ;o)
Does anyone have any more info on these 2.9L California '92 VR6s, as I've
never heard about their existence before??

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Mar  5 20:38 PST 1996
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Date: Tue, 05 Mar 1996 19:21:23 +0000 (UT)
From: ED FICKERT 
Subject: RE: EIP intake manifold
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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The VSR is not worth the money.  I had a chance to drive and race a car with 
the VSR.  My car has the basic bolt-ons (chip, filter, TB) and I pulled on the 
VSR equiped car easily.  The driver of the car is probably one of the most 
capable drivers on the list so I know it was not his driving skills.  He beat 
me in a race without the VSR(Very Slow Ride).  It was tested on a flow bench 
and it did poorly.  For the $2000 or so dollars you would spend on a VSR, 
someone else could spend it on other mods(cylinder head) and crush the VSR 
equiped car.  If you were to buy the EIP manifold you should also get the cams 
so the motor could make better use of the increased air flow.

Ed Fickert

----------
From: 	owner-corrado-l@teleport.com on behalf of Jeff Metzger
Sent: 	Tuesday, March 05, 1996 1:04 PM
To: 	Corrado-l@teleport.com
Subject: 	EIP intake manifold

               I was wondering what the difference is between the intake 
manifold by EIP and the VSR by VW motorsport. I know that EIP's is a factory 
intake but modified somehow.Are the gains in midrange as good as the VSR? If 
not is it worth paying a difference of some $1500 xtra for that difference?If 
the gains in midrange is close it might be worth $750.

 Jeff
93' Black-n-Tan
Metzgers@msn.com


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Mar  7 09:26 PST 1996
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Date: Thu, 07 Mar 1996 12:22:11 -0500
From: jlb14@po.cwru.edu (Jeffrey L. Brown)
Subject: HP Gains
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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To: corrado-l@teleport.com
Reply-To: jlb14@po.cwru.edu (Jeffrey L. Brown)
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        I have to say that 258hp from a measly .3l increase is unbelievable.  
        Something just don't add up.  The kit is I guess called stroker kit?  
        Which is a longer stroke crank and shorter pistons.  No block work, no 
        head work, no new intakes or cams

I don't know where this information was obtained from.  Here's dyno report
Edward posted.  Read carefully, at the bottom, all the mods made to this
motor beyond the .3 liter increase in displacement.  BTW to increase to 3.1
liters you must bore and stroke the motor.  Both.  
Not to be condescending, but aren't people paying attention to the 2.8/2.9
block controversy  (wall thickness, overheating, 82, 83 mm pistons, etc).
It flooded my mailbox.  
Remember, the bore on a 2.8 is 81.0 mm.  The 3.1 is 83 mm.


Here's the dyno report:

EIP Tuning 3.1 Litre VR6 (1992 Corrado) 
------------------------------------

Date of Dyno:     2/20/96 
Location   :        AutoThority Performance Engineering
                        Fairfax, Virginia, USA
Dyno Type:        Dual Roller Hydro-Kinetic (Clayton Chassis?)
Ambient Temp:   60-65 F 
Humidity:           High   

***************************************************************************
FRONT WHEEL HORSEPOWER, road hp

RPM	Base	Manifold	Exhaust
-------	-------	------------	------------
1,500	  51	  51	  53
2,000	  72	  72	  73
2,500	  94	  94	  94
3,000	117	119	120
3,500	148	153	150
4,000	181	187	191
4,500	204	215	217
5,000	216	231	236
5,500	225	239	248
6,000	233	243	258
6,500	222	240	251
7,000	198	225	236

***************************************************************************
TORQUE, Lb-ft 

RPM	Base	Manifold	Exhaust
-------	-------	------------	------------				
1,500	180	180	184
2,000	191	189	193
2,500	198	197	197
3,000	206	208	210
3,500	222	229	225
4,000	238	245	251
4,500	238	251	253
5,000	227	228	248
5,500	215	228	237
6,000	204	213	226
6,500	180	194	203
7,000	149	169	177
***************************************************************************
NOTE:

Base = EIP 3.1 kit (EIP 83mm pistons & Abt 95.6mm crankshaft), Schrick 268
cams, EIP large intake-valve modified head, Abt 67mm exhaust system.  Intake
Manifold & Chip were factory stock.

Manifold = Base + EIP-modified Intake Manifold + AutoThority-tuned Chip

Exhaust = Manifold + EIP-modified Exhaust (modified downpipe & cat-less)






I hope this clears up some of the ambiguity.

Jeff Brown


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Mar  7 11:02 PST 1996
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Date: Thu, 07 Mar 1996 13:58:27 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: 3.1l motor
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******************************************************************************
******
>The kit is I guess called stroker kit?  
>Which is a longer stroke crank and shorter pistons.  No block work, no 
>head work, no new intakes or cams.
>
> dmcree@ftw.paging.mot.com (Dan McRee)

   Hi, Dan, your scepticism is quite understandable, let me try to clarify
somewhat - the 258 road hp measured at the AutoThority dyno was for the EIP
3.1L conversion (longer 95.6mm stroke, wider 83mm bore, higher 11.1:1
compression ratio) + quite a few significant other mods, i.e. AutoThority
FlowTech filter, EIP modified t-body & intake manifold, EIP larger
intake-valve modified cylinder head, Schrick 268 cams that were custom
advanced, revised chip programme, EIP modified exhaust manifold & down-pipe,
cat-less, and the Autotech stainless steel exhaust system (rear muffler
only).  

   When replaced with the ultra-quiet and more emissions-legal Abt
stainless-steel 67mm exhaust system (cat, resonator, mid and rear mufflers)
as is the current setup, peak road hp fell to 243.  Sorry, I don't have any
measured or claimed power figures for the  3.1L conversion itself (no intake,
head, cam, exhaust work), all the 3.x projects that I'm aware of incorporated
all these additional mods in some form or the other to complement power
output...

>I'm just trying to 
>justify the $5000 for a crank and pistons.

   Over half of the 3.1 kit's price is from the Abt forged crankshaft, which
as you can see is not cheap!  My PERSONAL feeling is that whilst Abt makes
available a number of innovative high-quality performance parts, some of them
are rather overpriced (i.e. JT quoted me US $4,000 for a set of their 3-piece
wheels!).  

   True, Abt probably has an excellent reputation in Europe as being one of
the premium tuners, but you must bear in mind that quite a few of their
products are made by someone else (the Abt headers and exhaust are probably
from Sebring, and their 268 cams from Suko).  

   Sorry to go on a bit, I know how highly this forum holds German
Engineering in regard, but that doesn't mean that a part from Germany is
automatically superior to one from, say, the UK or the States just by virtue
of country of origin...

   As for shelling out $5000 for this kit (or $6500 for the Abt version), no,
it would be quite out-of-budget or not be worthwhile for most people. Half of
that for the 3.0L conversion may be more palatable for a few of us, otherwise
keeping the engine at 2.8L but throwing on cams or modifying the exhaust,
head or intake manifold, or just doing the "basic" Neuspeed mods would make
some happy. Heck, the Corrado in completely stock form is nothing to be
ashamed of, it's a beauty just as is!!! 

Edward

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Fri Mar  8 12:54 PST 1996
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Date: Fri, 08 Mar 1996 15:50:06 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: Corrected Displacements
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*************************************************************************
>Oh no! You already forgot the stroke of your original engine? 

   Guess it's a case of infidelity to the 2.8 ever since my tempestuous
affair with the 3.1 mistress...

>Nope, it's NOT 89.5mm (do you really think stock VR6s' stroke is
>THAT short? hehe), it's 90.3mm...

   Alright folks, here are the revised (corrected) displacement calculations,
assuming that the European, Canadian and US VR6s all have a stock stroke
length of 90.3mm:

		US 2.8	Euro 2.9	Abt 3.0?	EIP 3.0	Abt 3.1	EIP 3.1

Bore (mm) 	81	82	81	83	82.01	83
Stroke (mm)	90.3	90.3	95.6	90.3	95.6	95.6

cc		2792	2861	2956	2931	3030	3104


Edward

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat Mar  9 15:24 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 1996 18:19:37 -0500
From: VoidSpirit@aol.com
Subject: best way to jack a C for oil changes
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i have a 2 1/4 ton floor jack and two jack stands. when i change the oil in
my C i jack the car up from behind the front wheel at the jack point (where a
lift would contact the underbody) and then wedge a jack stand underneath the
front lower brace that runs underneath just in front of the oil cannister. Is
there a better way? jacking the car up about 18" (at one location only) looks
like it would stress/bend the chassis. My car is 1 inch lower than stock and
standard jack stands are awfully high even at their lowest setting - too high
to slide under most areas. i'd like to use what i have and not spend more
money on ramps or custom stands. any advice appreciated.
VoidSpiRit


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Mar 12 23:03 PST 1996
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Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 01:55:08 -0500
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Autotech is not an APE chip
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In a message dated 96-03-09 15:27:36 EST, you write:

> I have heard that Autotechs chip is 
>really Autothority's chip just much cheaper. Just like APS sells there chip
>to 
>plain wrap performance for much cheaper. Autotech's chip sells for $99, if
it
>
>is the same one as Autothority($275),

The chip that Autotech now sells for $99 is NOT an Autothority (APE) designed
or manufactured unit. APE used to produce chips for Autotech but not any
longer. 
It would not be possible to sell a chip like the APE for under a hundred
bucks. A 
great deal of time & money needs to be invested when developing a chip as 
comprehensive as the Autothority Performance chip. Remember, chips like the 
APE are not full throttle only enhancements. These are chips that are
re-mapped & improved from idle to rev limit and all areas between. Things
that you won't find in 
most lesser, budget chips. I am not saying that the Autotech chip is one of
these 
cheap chips, just posting some observations and a few facts. Draw your own 
conclusions.
Also, all APE chips are designed on there in-house chassis dyno, one of the
most accurate, updated dyno's available. Using custom engineered software,
highly 
accurate computer monitoring and chip emulating devices, APE is able to
continuosly monitor and modify their chips program. Chips can be altered at
any and all points to acheive the best possible results. 
In fairness, Neuspeed & AMS (Advanced Motorsport Solutions) chips are made in

a similiar fashion, justifying there similiar costs (as compared to APE). One
thing 
among many that we like about the AMS chip is that they have a really nice
"soft" 
rev limiter that doesn't shut the car off all at once. It feels like you are
simply running 
out of power (which you are) allowing you to shift to the next gear without
the full 
shut down & subsequent drop in acceleration of most other chips.
Just thought you'd like to know,
---------> RICH !! <---------Don't forget the old adage: You get what you pay
for!

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat Mar 16 11:24 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 13:58:49 -0500
From: VoidSpirit@aol.com
Subject: Q-Chip, SP 8000's - my driving impressions
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Q-Chip 
Cost: $99
First, the Q-chip is now being manufactured by/for Autotech, and is not an
Autothority Chip. (someone please update the fossilized FAQ on chips,
please).
Stated gain is 7 hp max, with consistent improvements from idle to redline.
Autotechs comment about their lower price was that it reflects a marketing
approach - sell at lower profit margin but will more than make up for it in
add'l sales.
My impression:
Installation is easy. remember to check and see if you need a torx
screwdriver before starting the install on a VR6. A US hex wrench ( 5/64)
will suffice however as a so-so substitute (sloppy fit). Also: slide the
black air box tab left toward the fender when viewed from the front with a
long, big bladed slot screwdriver. Pay careful attention to how the wiring
harness connector unplugs from the ECU box to assist you when installation is
complete and you are trying to plug the tricky little thing back in.
Anyway...
The Chip gave me a slightly smoother idle. Not silky smooth, just slightly.
The chip makes my car's throttle response more spritely. It's a lot like the
difference you'd get advancing the distributor a few degrees on a older GTI.
Silly words like zippy and peppy come to mind. Sorry, no European Car
hyperbole here.
That's about it. For $99 i'm pleased. I would have felt like a REAL fanatic
if i had spent $250 ...

The SP 8000's- 
mail ordered these from Discount Tire and had the local Discount Tire install
them. The installer had a nitrous equipped honda that he claimed would blow
my doors off. Hmm. Apparently felt threatened just looking at my car. (The
manager later told me the installer "really liked my car")
The SP's look nice, are quiet and smooth riding. I can still chirp the tires
hard in 2nd, but otherwise haven't pushed them yet.
Treadwear rating is 200, same as my SP2000's, which gave me 25k miles.
hope this information is useful.
Voidspirit





From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Mar 25 20:46 PST 1996
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Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 20:24:08 -0800 (PST)
From: Jan Vandenbrande 
Subject: Home made T-Body mods (fwd)
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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> 	For you experts in t-body mods (Brian??), can you please tell me if
> it's possible, without special tools, to remove the restrictive ramp of the
> t-body?
> 	Is it possible to remove the t-body, flushing the ramp and reinstalling
> the t-body, with "normal" srewdrivers and wrenches?
> 
> Thanks,

As usual, I think it's in one of the archives (VR6_Power_Upgrades)...
what else would you expect me to say. 

The problem is that if you grind away the ramp entirely you end up
with a hole because the reverse side of the ramp is depressed.

However, I just came back from Westec/Autofact (a machining & CAD/CAM
software show) and found an amazing putty called Lab-metal.
It's basically aluminum in an adhesive solution that's machinable
after it dries and solidifies. I dont know how strong the stuff is but it seems 
adequate for filling up the depression at the other side of the air ramp.
I have sample on my desk.

It's a bit like JD Weld which may be a cheaper and easier to obtain
solution.

In any case, their number is 800 828 1004 ask for Lab Metal or where you
could buy it (it's really an industrial product). If any one knows
whether this is any could let us know.

--
              o   ___|___    [\\]    | Jan Vandenbrande jan@ug.eds.com
   __0    /\0/   /-------\      _    | http://alicudi.usc.edu:80/~jan/ 
   \<,_  O  \\  (_________)  .#/_\_. | "Aerodynamics are for people who
(_)/ (_)    //  [_]     [_]  |_(_)_| | cannot build engines" - Enzo Ferrari

From Francis.Lamonde@hec.ca Thu Mar 28 14:07 PST 1996
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Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 17:02:35 -0500
From: Corrado-Porsche 
Subject: Re: Home made VR6 T-Body
To: Jan Vandenbrande 
Message-Id: <315B0C7B.2F98@hec.ca>
Organization: Ecole des Hautes Etudes Commerciales de Montreal
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Jan Vandenbrande wrote:
>             If you file off the ramp, you get::
> 
>             _______________
>                 |
>                 o
>                 |        ====> Air flow
>             ______   ______
> 
>             but what you want is
>             _______________
>                 |
>                 o
>                 |        ====> Air flow
>             _______________

	Ok, now I get your point... hmm.... I'll check out what should I
do... Thanks for your help

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Frank				St-Bruno (near Montreal), Quebec, Canada
				E-Mail : Francis.Lamonde@Hec.ca

'93 Green VR6 : Power cloth Recaros, Ray-Ban green tints, custom airbox,
		28k miles, 182hp, very satisfied.
'96 Black Audi A4 : Not mine, FWD, electronicaly controlled automatic
		    5-speed transmission, black power leather seats, wood,
		    automatic ventillation system, infrared alarm, 1k mile,
		    172hp, very satisfied.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

From Francis.Lamonde@hec.ca Wed Mar 27 14:55 PST 1996
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Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 17:50:03 -0500
From: The Only True Cars Are Corrados 
Subject: Re: Home made VR6 T-Body
To: Jan Vandenbrande 
Message-Id: <3159C61B.3FDC@hec.ca>
Organization: Ecole des Hautes Etudes Commerciales de Montreal
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Jan Vandenbrande wrote:
> In the rear of the TBody right in front of the throttle
> The depressions is on the outside:
>            _______________
>                |
>                o
>                |  _     ====> Air flow
>            ______/ \______
> 
>                   ^ Depression

	Ok... so I have to put that adhesive stuff in it?

Ok, thanks,
-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Frank				St-Bruno (near Montreal), Quebec, Canada
				E-Mail : Francis.Lamonde@Hec.ca

'93 Green VR6 : Power cloth Recaros, Ray-Ban green tints, custom airbox,
		28k miles, 182hp, very satisfied.
'96 Black Audi A4 : Not mine, FWD, electronicaly controlled automatic
		    5-speed transmission, black power leather seats, wood,
		    automatic ventillation system, infrared alarm, 1k mile,
		    172hp, very satisfied.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat Apr  6 10:21 PST 1996
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Date: Sat, 06 Apr 1996 13:16:58 -0500 (EST)
From: Slctom@cris.com
Subject: Re: Cams (EC article)
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: Hulda Jowett 
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On Thu, 4 Apr 1996 15:00:44 -0500 in Email: All you wrote:
HJ>> there was NO GAIN in going from the Schrick 260 -
HJ>> to the 268 on the dyno.  They explained why and all
HJ>> but that still doesn't make sense to me.  If that's
HJ>> the case why make the 2 different cams?!?!

HJ>two reasons I can think of. The 268 does make a few more hp way up high,
HJ>in Germany where top speed is king, where do you want the power? When
HJ>racing (although you'd probably have an even hotter cam) that extra few
HJ>would be nice also.

HJ>You really feel that lump of torque in the mids w/ the 260, and they rev
HJ>much better after 4k rpm than stock. Hope this helps.

  According to someone at Rons Parts I called last week, he said the 268's
really come on nice at 3,000 RPM's.  He also said there was a 5-7 hp
increase with the 268 over the 260 cams.  It seems like we have some
conflicting views here that should be cleared up.

Tom Trawinski
1993 Corrado SLC                                          "Wind in my hair,
Flash Red/Black Leather                              shifting and drifting,
6 Disc CD Changer, Passat cupholder                       mechanical music,
2 sets of Speedlines                                      adrenalin surge."

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Apr  9 21:08 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 09 Apr 1996 23:59:57 -0400
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Re: exhaust info...New Header Etc.
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This gives me a great oportunity to tell everyone about the new Header system
that we just recently received for testing. An Australian company called
Genie (see EC for recent ads) has been developing a header and complete
exhaust system for VR6 VW's.Since the SEMA show last year, we have been
working with Genie and their North American Distributor. The VR6 header is
their latest offering to their very high quality exhaust line-up. 
With out a doubt, this header is FAR superior in design, quality, and
construction to the ABT header. It is Stainless with large primaries, a well
designed collector with huge twin down pipes. Also there is a large Stainless
flex coupling that mates to the factory cat.
One header was sent to the West Coast about two months ago for testing on a
new VR6 GTI. Results were OK on a stock car, showing mild gains in the lower
rpm range. Much better than the ABT's reported loss of HP. Since then they
have refined the header and have completed the VR6 Exhaust system. The Header
was designed to fit AIII VR6 cars (no Corrado's in Australia). We are in the
process of test fitting the Header on a Corrado. If modifications are needed,
than we will have Genie produce a seperate header for the Corrado. As for the
cat back system, we have not yet recieved it, when we do the process will be
similiar. The cat-back system is on a ship due to arrive at the end of the
week, I'll keep the list posted. 
>From what I've seen from Genie thus far, they are capable of some of the
finest exhaust building in the world.
-----------> RICH !! <------------

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Apr 24 02:16 PDT 1996
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Date: Wed, 24 Apr 1996 05:11:46 -0400
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: VR6 HEADER FOR CORRADO / 3.0L TESTS
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Yes it fits! I had written a while back about the new header system that we
had just recieved from Genie. As I said back then, it is without a doubt, one
of the finest headers I have ever seen. It is head & shoulders above the
header that ABT carries. Large thick SS tubing, excellent collector etc. The
only problem was that there are no Corrado's in Australia where Genie is
located. So the header is only listed for Golf VR6. 

Well as part of our arrangement with Genie, we recieved the first system that
hit the US dock (besides one air freighted to Turbo magazine for there
upcoming article on the 95 Golf VR6) a few weeks ago. Well we test fitted it
on our 3.0L Corrado project car, it fits like a glove!!! The flex coupling
connects perfectly to the cat. and installation is extremely easy. The header
comes in three (3) pieces and is the easiest / quickest we've ever installed.
It also comes with a well designed heat sheild (very necessary) that reduces
underhood temperatures considerably.

Then we decided to try it for seat of pants testing and then some track
times...
Well...It is Excellent. Very noticable low end torque increase with great
mid-range response. On the highway (private roads of course...) the header
makes a noted difference during roll-on acceleration testing (ie. 55-75mph &
75-95mph etc.) 

Next we went to the Drag Strip...Well first run, our boy Steve (car owner)
missed second and only managed a 14.6 @ 97.4 mph. Second run... well, after
heating up our track tires (soft Comp T/A's - low pressure), he was going for
a 13's. Well he managed to shear off the right side drive shaft AGAIN !! The
cars Quaiffe works great, tires are biting, halfshafts are now the weak link.
This is the second one. Well we are in the process of solving this problem,
Custom Chrome-moly shafts are being made. I wonder what is next?  
Thought you'd like to be the first to know...
---------> RICH !! <---------

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Apr 29 21:04 PDT 1996
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Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 14:21:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: More 260 cam results
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Well this weekend I was again thanking Dr. Schrick. A friend of mine  
from Philly was around, and i wanted to see what $700 really did for my 
car. He has a 93 VR6 C, modded airbox, ported t-body, and custom chip. I 
have 93 VR6 C, modded airbox, ported t-body, P-chip, 260 cams, suitcase 
removed. He was mouthing off about how his custom chip made for his car 
would be faster blah blah. Lets go race'n mouthy. 

 My car pulls right from the start. by the time we reach 80 or 90 I have 
about 3 or 4 car lengths, 120 about 5. rember there is only about a 10 hp 
difference between the cars. We switched cars and got the same results. 
We both noticed that my car hooks up WAY better. We have the same D40 
tires. I have all the aftermarket suspension though, he only has Bilstein 
shocks. I think the poly bushings help alot too. 

Later

Brian

From hjowett@pine.nasc.mass.edu Wed May  1 13:35 PDT 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 16:32:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Re: VR6 Manifold mod diagrams
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EIP claims a gain of 9 ft/lbs of torque when used with their throttle 
body.... they did not say what rpm, or list any other mods that may have 
been done. I got the diagram from Garret Lim, he use to work at 
Techtonics. He says no gain by doing this unless you have the cams. I'm 
guessing there will be a small gain in the mids, with most of the gain up 
high. Garret also said there's no one piece that will give ALOT of power, 
each gives a little, in the end it all starts to add up. 

Not sure if the manifold will warp when welded, nothing ventured nothing 
gained!
 I am suprised at the amount of responses I've recieved on this, so I 
will probably post to the list.

Later   Brian

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed May 29 22:15 PDT 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 01:13:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Re: upgrades...
In-Reply-To: <01BB4DA9.AF4B9AC0@pdantes.glasscity.net>
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Here's the rundown of what really works.

P-flow - NO! Modify the airbox and install a K&N.

Chip - Yes, 3 hp maybe, price is great!

T-body??? Been told by many it's a waste (Techtonics, Rons Parts). I 
think there's a hp or two hiding up high.

Cams YES! 260s are best. Do these before intake manifold.

Exaust NO! C has a great exaust. If you had a GTI or GLX you get 6 hp by 
doing it, this is because they have a crappy exaust unlike the C's.

Header ????

Intake has a restriction, wether or not HP will be gained???

VSR Yes, big lump of torque in the mids.

2.9 - 3.1. Power to had, expensive. 

Comments???

Brian

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed May 29 19:31 PDT 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 21:56:13 -0400
From: Paolo Dominguez 
Subject: upgrades...
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Hey C-lovers,

I was talking to a local tuner and was asking him about what would be =
the most logical steps, taking cost and performance into consideration.  =
The tuner is a Neuspeed Distributor and so has knowlegde of the VW =
setup.

He first told me what already most have done to their cars.  Buy the =
P-flow, chip, and throttle body(questionable at this stage).

Then he stated that the next logical step would be to get a new exhaust. =
 He said that the factory exhaust was VERY restrictive, and that an =
aftermarket exhaust would do wonders.  He recommended Sebring, and the =
new carbon fibre Remus exhaust.  He was speaking of the cat.back =
exhaust.

After getting the exhaust, he said that to allow more flow, and to =
increase Hp significantly again, was to get some Headers.  He =
recommended ABT and VW Motorsport(?).  He said these run around 1k to =
1.5k.

Now that you have a full breathing system, to take another leap in HP, =
you should get some cams.  Shrick was his recommendation.  He said you =
really should not get the cams until you get the headers and exhaust =
because you won't be able to capture the cams full potential.

Now you can grab an intake manifold, like EIP's or VSR.  This is where =
you should get the oversized throttle body for full effect (if you don't =
already have it).

If you still have money left over, the stroker kit is next (3.1L).  Of =
course....you have to have quite a bit of money left.  Then comes the =
supercharger or turbo, to make your corrado the fastest and most =
expensive there is. =20

Well, what do you think?  Is he right?  Obviously there can be some =
variation to this, but for the most part, cost wise, he seems to be =
correct.  Any opinions or other upgrades that can be squeezed in? =20

Thanks
-Paolo
Neuspeed tuned
93 SLC (following the previous steps.....on my way to the exhaust and =
headers)

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat May 25 16:06 PDT 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 18:58:32 +0000
From: "Jason D. Livingood/WSC" 
Subject: Re: Add-ons about the max possible hp on a VR6.
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: Frank 
Cc: Corrado-l-digest 
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I am interested to get more tech info from EIP or another tuner on this.  I got 
a bunch of paperwork and dyno results on the engine but seem to be unable to 
find them.  On the less technical side, I had a chance to ride in their 3.1L.  
They improved not just the powerplant, though, because that's only part of the 
equation.  They also modified the intake and exhaust which is important to 
note.  

Also, my impression having driven in the car was that this car had _well_ over 
220 hp.  The exact number....who really cares in my mind.  I mean I do care -- 
it is good to compare the numbers of Hp.  But peak Hp is only part of the 
equation.  The peak Hp of a Vtec engine may be okay but it only becomes 
apparent at like 6500 rpm.  There is not a steady amount of power throughout 
the powerband and there is not too much torque.  I had an older 90 Integra and 
to get power out of that engine, as with every other Japanese engine, I had to 
be taching this thing out non-stop!  The Corrado's VR6 is the opposite of that 
-- silky, smooth power applied steadily throughout the full range of RPMs.  The 
torque is also very nice.

Now, to share my impressions of the EIP 3.1L.  It had buckets full of torque 
and the power was very steady -- not a spike of Hp at the end without the 
midrange.  I seem to remember that the tires (17 inch wheels) chirped into 2nd 
and 3rd and a tiny bit into 4th.  This f-ing monster had GOBS of power and 
pushed me into the seat with the vengence of an unemployed field hockey coach.  
The experience was so over the top incredible that I cannot put into words all 
of the sensations.  If I had had a few thousand $$ in my pocket my Corrado 
would have stayed at EIP for the conversion.  I would class this with other 
powerful cars I have driven, among them a 944 Turbo and an older 930 Turbo.  It 
was that fast.  And it stopped fast and turned fast and, and and .....  And I'm 
gonna see it again next week at Buttonwillow and I can't wait.

Jason Livingood - jlivingood@hammer.net

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat May 25 09:41 PDT 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 12:36:46 -0400
From: Frank 
Subject: RMR Autosport and EIP's 3.1
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I called RMR Autosport (see ads in E/C last 2 months) and oh my god, I have
lost to tell about everything! EIP's 3.1, the max possible hp for a VR6,
etc., etc... Quite confusing...
	First, RMR only ship parts across Canada... but they are affiliated
with mecanics who do mods for them... The guy, Richard, told me that it's
impossible that EIP's 3.1 puts out 293 wheel hp (258 road hp). Techtonics
invested more than 28k$US on 4 different modified head's, for the VR6 and they
NEVER reached more than 204hp (wheel) for the head. They were a lot disappointed.
On the VR6, doing head and block mods are not worth the money. I don't agree,
however.
	He said that a 2-valves/cyl. engine is difficult to modified a lot.
NASCAR engines puts out 650hp for a 5.0-liter, wich is 130hp/liter, a max
for a 2-valves/cyl engine. And they are using moded parts that we CAN'T use
for street (and also methanol or 98+ octane fuel). After many years of R&D
(TT, ABT, Euro tuners, etc.), for the GTI 8v 2.0-liter, 75hp/liter was about
to be a max, according to him (TRUE DYNO FIGURES), for an normal ASPIRATED
engine, of course. So if you take 75hp x 3.1 = 232.8hp. This should be ABOUT
the real wheel hp of EIP's 3.1. The VR6 is already very high in the hp/liter
power ratio (63.6). The guy did few trips in Europe and checked out the 3.1s
there, and with 95.6mm crank and all other stuff, Euro tuners never reached
above 230bhp, which is a bit less than 30% of power above stock. He said that
it's very easy to false dyno figures : unload the engine, crank the RPM (I
don't understand, and I don't know if he really said that like this) and reload
the engine. I said, well, look, that car (EIP's 3.1) is pulling harder in 3rd
than a p-flowed/NS chipped/NS t-bodied stock VR6 in 2nd. He said, never trust
Internet (but I do trust fellows like you), and if it's true, well it's cuz of
the torque, not the hp! But traction problems will appear with that amount of
torque, so you loose a lot of power and traction and your times are dropping.
Get an AWD car, maybe it'll help a LOT! ;-)
	I closed the discussion in saying that the figures, I DON'T CARE,
the concrete facts are more important to me. He said, well, TEST the car first,
invest 600$ in a trip in Maryland and test the engine by yourself. Maybe it
has a lot of torque, so that's why the car seems to pull harder, but the hp
should not be above 230-235... Or it's a revolution in VR6's modifications
(accordint to me, it's already a revolution). He said that he know EIP's
3.1-liter kit, but just a bit. So he told me to meet him with a bunch of infos
on the 3.1 and he'll revised the numbers with me and maybe drop a call to Rich
at EIP. Yes, they can do the installation of the engine if I want one.
	I don't care about what he said, I just care about the facts. If really
EIP's 3.1 is pulling THAT hard, well no matter the figures, it's just like if
it has a lot more power and torque, but the numbers it has, we must NOT care
of, unless it's "certified/approved dynoed". He also said that having more than
250hp would be for race purposes... so NOT for normal and everyday driving on
streets. For a normal aspirated engine, of course.
	Investing more than 7k$ (for the engine) on a VR6 is too much for him.
Cuz you won't get enough gains for the money you'll put on, and you'll loose
reliability. Maybe EIP's 3104cc puts out a "mere" 225-230hp, but I'm sure it has
more than that in torque! So I don't care, the results on streets are more
important. Now, he said : Eddy, GET FEW 0-60 and 1/4 MILE TIMES! With those
numbers, we'll be able to see if really the engine is that great.
	EDDY, BRING YOUR CAR BACK TO EIP/AUTOTHORITY AND HAVE A PROFESSIONAL
RACER TEST THE 0-60 AND 1/4 MILE TIMES!
	Those results should express the real power of that huge engine from
the South. ;-)
	I'd say that without those SEVERELY TESTED times, I won't trust the
293bhp of EIP's 3.1. However, I'd buy one though if it really pulls as hard
as you all guys said. ;-)
	Rich at RMR uses lots of formulas, for engine power to check that.
You can't get the VR6 up to 500hp (even 400 and even 300!) without having a
turbo or a supercharger (for street), it's impossible. Look, NASCAR 5.0-liter
are at their MAX with 650hp!!!!!!! So Lance, if you're still here (I don't
think so, but just in case), go to hell with your further 400hp NON-TURBO/
SUPERCHARGED little 2.8-liter VR6, it's simply IMPOSSIBLE to get such power
lie you said. Ok, like you calculated it, yes, but not with severely done and
approved dyno figures, and 0-60-1/4 miles times. The VR6 is already a very high
engine in design to get 178bhp with 2-valves/cylinder. Hey, a Probe with a
2.5-liter 24-valve engine gets only 164hp. Is you bore/stroke that engine up
to 3.0-liter, you'll get more power easier than a 2.8-liter 12-valves
bored/stroked VR6 up to 3.0-liter. So VW (and don't forget that the VR6 is at
15 degree, so it's not a normal V6 at the beginning, so maybe it was more
difficult to get power out of this engine) did a very great job on our VR6
engines.
	That's what Rich at RMR taught me... and confused me... I'll do a run
up to Ville St-Laurent as soon as I can, with a bunch of stuff on EIP's 3.1.
So send me ALL what you have in PRIVATE e-mail. I'll gather all this and show
him what I have. I already have the infos EIP sent by snail mail few weeks
ago.
	I do trust EIP, and is 3.1, but still, 293bhp is impossible for Rich
at RMR. So we must check. Like I said, if we could AT LEAST get the 0-60 and
1/4 mile times of EIP's 3.1, it could SERIOUSLY help us to figure out how strong
is that engine.
	I know it's a long post, but it adds something we never discussed about
earlier. Well, not that way, so maybe it can clear up a bit... it'll clear up
as soon as we'll get the 0-60 and 1/4 miles times... Cuz these numbers explained
MUCH more what an engine is capable of. A 650hp Turbo Porsche can do the 0-60
in 4.4, a 850hp in 4.1. But HELL, what a difference in the 30-50/50-70/70-90mph
times between those!!!!!!!!!!
	Eddy, get those numbers, and get a complete test with the 30-50/50-70
and 70-90 times, just like if C&D or Motor Trend, or R&D was testing your lets
say "production" car (I'm saying production, cuz they rarely test moded cars).

	Maybe hp simply means nothing for a car...

Excuse my screwed up english (grammar and vocabulary).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Frank				St-Bruno (near Montreal), Quebec, Canada
Corrado Club of America member	E-Mail : Francis.Lamonde@Hec.ca

'93 Green VR6 : Power cloth Recaros, Ray-Ban green tints, custom air box,
		black rear VW/VR6's emblems, 28k miles, 182hp.
'96 Black Audi A4 : Father's car, black luxurious leather interior, 172hp.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Fri May 31 15:33 PDT 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 15:28:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gary Yuen 
Subject: Re: corrado-l-digest V1 #633
In-Reply-To: 
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To: Hulda Jowett 
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On Fri, 31 May 1996, Hulda Jowett wrote:

> > >Chip - Yes, 3 hp maybe, price is great!
> > 
> > Try 6hp, increased driveability/removed spped limiter
> 
> I don't think 6hp is a realistic expectation for a chip, I could be 
> wrong! 
  
     Sounds like Mike had someone dyno it on his car.  Right Mike?  I 
just go by the dyno figures claimed by Neuspeed.  I think Tim also dynoed 
it and he can also tell us.  


> > >T-body??? Been told by many it's a waste (Techtonics, Rons Parts). I 
> > >think there's a hp or two hiding up high.
> > 
> > Dyno'ed it. it works. Please ask Techtonics why everybody other than them
> > gets better gains out of a 268 cam than a 260.  
> 
> OK, U.S. spec car 178, euro 190, your telling me that a t-body adds 5 hp 
> and 100cc of displacment add only 8???
>  
     I don't think the t-body adds to the peak hp.  I don't have dyno 
figures in front of me but I remember that the t-body only adds hp above 
6 or 6.5k rpm, most of it probably being above where it peaks. 

> > >Cams YES! 260s are best. Do these before intake manifold.
> >
> > Best is a relative thing. I'll take my VR with the 268s against a Vr 
> with 260's
> > any day. The idle is nowhere near as bad as everyone makes it out to be. And 
> > I haven't lost any low end either.(Once again, I have the dyno worksheets to
> > prove it.) The car does feel sluggish on the low end, but its due to the 
> > shifted powerband+throttle body. 
> 
> I agree with your relative thing statement. For the some the 268 may be 
> better. you may think the idle is fine, 
> others may think it's far too rough, you seem to be in the minority on 
> the view that they idle fine. That's right, your car is sluggish down low 
> because you lost lowend.

     Have you tried a 268 car?   I don't have one myself yet but I've 
driven Ed's car and the idle feels very smooth.  It feels slightly 
different but Jeff from Velocity(who was in the car during the time) said 
it was probably the ABT crankshaft since he's installed 268's and the 
wasn't bad at all.  

     About losing low end, you probably do but it does seem that several 
tuners have said that the gains of the 268's make it a better cam than 
the 260 if you drive hard.  Actually, Aaron said Schrick is discontinuing 
the 260's and they bought the last batch so if you want them... 
   
> > >Exaust NO! C has a great exaust. If you had a GTI or GLX you get 6 hp by 
> > >doing it, this is because they have a crappy exaust unlike the C's.
> > 
> > Exhaust is the same. the Catalytic converter in the C is metal based core
> > opposed to the ceramic core of the GOlf/Jetta's.
> 
> Nope, C's have a free flow rear muffler. I know for sure GLXs don't, I'm 
> assuming GTIs have the same exaust since they are 6hp down on a C too.
> I thought all VRs had metal kats??

     We'll find out when someone dyno's a Corrado exhaust.  Tim?

>  > >Header ????
> > the ABT header makes 3hp increase from 6200-7000. Not worth it look at your 
> > above statement.
> 
> Must have an awful hp/$$ ratio.

      Sounds like the Genie headers are better though.  

> > >Intake has a restriction, wether or not HP will be gained???
> > 
> > Not a restriction. The air is designed by the factory to flow the way it does
> > to reach equal acoustical length throughout the intake system. I have the
> > factory 
> > service manual that explains it all if you wish. To gain 
> 
> I'd would be interested to see this manual, or just tell all what is says 
> on the list. The more info we have on these things the better off all 
> will be. 

      I'd be interested too.  It seems people have gains from the EIP and 
ExtrudeHoned manifolds but very few people have them.  I think Ed's dyno 
sheet had a separate dyno for the manifld but it included other things 
(chip??).  But it would still be useful to look at it.  

    Yeah, it's hard figuring out which actually provides gains or not.  I 
only have a chip, t-body, exhaust, and P-flo w/intake on my GLX and I 
haven't really done much testing with each of them separately but I 
defniitely got some gains when I added each part.  But now after these 
parts, what's next?   

Gary

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Jun  3 06:48 PDT 1996
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Date: Mon, 03 Jun 1996 09:45:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Re: Intake manifold Design
In-Reply-To: <199606030525.WAA10676@intermind.net>
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Hmmmm...is this talking about the runners only? I realize that the lower 
section is different for the two different types intake ports, three are a 
tall oval (for the short length ports) and the other three are round long 
ports. The mods that are made to the intake deal with the upper section, 
before the runners even begin. 5 and 6 are slightly starved for air flow 
by the upper section.

Later,
Brian 93 VR6 C  

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sun Jun  2 22:38 PDT 1996
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Date: Sun, 02 Jun 1996 22:25:21 -0700
From: corrado@intermind.net (Michael Balasko)
Subject: Intake manifold Design
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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I have gotten more email about the design of the factory intake manifold
than I thought possible. So I am going to explain why the mainfold is
designed the way it is, and why hollowing it out and maiking it bigger
internally
in not what you want to do. I have the picture of the mainfold in cutaway form,
mail me if you want the pic. 

Service Training Self-study Program 402. 
Volkswagen Part Number WSP 521-402-00
And I quote p.20 "Volumetric Efficiency must be uniform to attain smooth
engine running 
and optimal power output under all operating conditions. This, in turn,
requires identical
flow conditions into the intake ports of all cylinders. Since the lengths of
the intake 
runners in the VR-6 cylinder head are not equal, it was necessary to
compensate with the 
internal design of the intake mainfold. All air intake passages are 420mm long."

Later,

Mike
 


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Jun  6 18:44 PDT 1996
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Date: Thu, 06 Jun 1996 18:35:01 -0700
From: "Edward John M. Thai" 
Subject: Turbo VR6 Newsflash & sundries
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Well, I've just heard that the fabled twin-turbo 3.1L VR6 from Ron's 
Parts is destined to remain just that, a legend in our minds...  Richie 
Chen, owner of the RPI 3.1L Passat GLX, has apparently let go of his 
car!  He sold the motor to a friend with a GTI VR6, swapped
motors and then got rid of the Passat.  What did he buy?  A 993 Carrera 
4, what else!  (Thanks for the update, Rob)

   But don't despair quite yet, all ye forced induction fans out there. 
 I'm probably not supposed to let the cat out of the bag yet, but it's 
more than rumours that EIP's assembling a high-boost turbo VR6 right as 
we speak, with a debut slated at the Import Shoot-Outs or Waterfest.  

   ND is also ready to do a prototype of their turbo VR6 whenever 
someone's prepared to put down a sizeable deposit for this project, so 
start saving up as we'd all love to see such a beast brought to life!  
(Actually a turbo kit should be more affordable than a complete 3.1 
conversion, so there should be a bigger market for this forced 
induction approach)

   Beyond that, ND can order one of those impressive TEC supercharged 
VR6s, and EIP will be doing a Cetoni Turmat conversion shortly after 
their turbo.  There are also unsubstantiated rumours of a couple of 
other tuners considering marketing a turbo kit for the VR6...

   By the way, my 3.1 is no longer an only child, she has just been 
joined by an EIP 3.1 sibling in the guise of an A2 Golf chassis!  By all 
accounts (and I believe it!), this car's even more devastatingly faster 
than its predecessor...  I'm just hoping that this 3.1L A2 VR6 and its 
turbo relative will uphold the VW reputation at the Import Shoot-Outs, 
especially against the hordes of tweaked out Hondas and Acuras that are 
going to strut their stuff out there!

   Oh, quite a few of you have emailed me wondering why I'd be so 
daft as to want to part with my slick Wilwoods.  Well, I'm always happy 
to share info so that other enthusiasts can find out the options 
available to them, and hopefully learn from my mistakes, so here's the 
scoop:  

   As wonderfully effective as the current Wilwoods are (ask anyone who 
already has them, or who has driven my car!), I'm looking into either a 
12.2 or even 13" front rotor setup with correspondingly larger Wilwoods 
(in anticipation for some potential track work in the future), pretty 
sick, eh?  The only downside is the cost factor as I'm relatively broke 
at this stage, however I'm hoping to get a good deal being a test car 
and prototype for this conversion.  And no, I'm not looking at the AP 
setup available from Europe as they are out of my budget range, tempting 
as they may be...

Cheers,
Edward

From corblimy@creative.net Fri Jun  7 10:14 PDT 1996
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Date: Fri, 07 Jun 1996 10:11:50 -0700
From: "Edward John M. Thai" 
Subject: [Fwd: Re: 3.1]
To: "Jason_D.._Livingood"@hammer.net, bwhite@thepoint.net, jan@UG.EDS.COM,
        hjowett@nasc.mass.edu, nsnyder@sugar-land.dowell.slb.com
Cc: Vreihen@aol.com, BKXPSC@tevm2.nsc.com, karl@advansys.com,
        kafka@cats.ucsc.edu, wkgee@ucdavis.edu
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FYI  (since there has been some controversy surrounding the actual 
output of the 3.1...) I hope to drive the car to MD beginning of July to 
catch the Import Shoot Outs and Waterfest, then fly back while EIP works 
on the car. At least there'll be no charge for parts and labour. Almost 
tempted to ask them to throw in 84mm pistons, or their new turbo, but 
alas, no funds are available in the near future.  :-< 

   Hopefully they'll test the motor for power (Autothority or other 
dyno) and oil consumption before shipping the car back to me.  Aaron 
wants to dyno the car at the APS facility, so I'll probably get that 
done (plus possibly a re-dyno at ND) then.

   The saga continues...

************************************************************************

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To: "Edward John M. Thai" 
From: "Jason D. Livingood/WSC"
  
Date:  7 Jun 96  8:36:09 
Subject: Re: 3.1
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Cool!!!  Glad if I was able to help in some small way.  They are sort of using 
yor car as a test bed, after all.  I look forward to seeing the car again as 
soon as it is back to full potential!!

Jason

To: Jason D. Livingood
cc:  
From: corblimy @ creative.net ("Edward John M. Thai") @ SMTP
Date: 06/06/96 08:12:10 PM
Subject: 3.1

Jason, I got around to chatting with Rich today, he mentioned that 
you guys had a conversation about the 3.1, and that he's definitely 
going to replace my pistons with a new, tighter-fitting design coupled 
with a better ring pack, etc., which they're already using on the 3.0L 
VR6s and couple of 3.1s they've put together so far, with oil 
consumption apparently comparable to stock!

   EIP may also prepare a short block in advance to reduce downtime, but
will still need the con-rods and crank from my motor as these have been
pre-balanced, so the remedied and improved 3.1 probably will not 
(realistically) be ready until the end of July...

   The positive aspect of this situation is that Rich seemed geniunely 
apologetic and will do this work for free, may even end up paying for 
shipping the car back to CA (about $1200 or so!).  He said my loss of 
power is definitely related to the oil leak problem which he'd like to 
address ASAP and get my car back to its original performance level, as 
in his opinion there shouldn't be any doubts on what this 3.1 can really 
do when performing to its full potential...

Edward

 



--------------583F5B8A1798--


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat Jun  8 13:11 PDT 1996
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Date: Sat, 08 Jun 1996 16:02:48 -0400
From: VR6Maniac@aol.com
Subject: Quest for VR6 POWER
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Help, I'm a little confused, would appreciate some solid advice 
from you guys -- already done the Neuspeed chip, t-body and p-flo 
things to my VR6 -- now ready for the big boys mods with some rad 
power -- been saving and ready to plunk down some serious cashola...

But, man, I've gotten back conflicting feedback from the VW shops -- 
I know each tuner would prefer to push their stuff but I don't know who
to believe anymore -- could do with some help in sorting out the 
geniune article from the bullshit (scuse the lingo) -- anyway, here's
 the results of my research:

JT Motorsports says go with the whole Abt 3.1/VSR manifold package, 
the components are made to complement each other, all the domestic 
stuff are a waste of money (a scam in his words) cos the Germans 
have more experience and superior engineering -- expect a final output of 
260 hp MINIMUM -- he also told me to get rid of my Neuspeed stuff as 
they cause a loss in torque...

Next AMS says similar things, they really put down the Neuspeed stuff 
especially the P-chip -- they recommend an Abt 3.0 (with AMS custom 
machined pistons) or 3.1, with Abt cams (better than Schricks) and headers
 -- the Techtonics or EIP head with a Techtonics exhaust were endorsed
 -- with AMS's proprietary chip tuning program, should see 250-275 hp if I 
purchased all of the above...

Rally Motorsports recommended the Abt 3.1, told me to read the European
Car article on their project car -- it puts out 256 hp on the dyno when first
built, 
now probably the fastest of its kind with close to 300hp after breaking in --

also required would be a VSR, Abt headers, lightened flywheel plus a special
ring gear for extra acceleration...

EIP were reserved about Abt, says not all of their products are as great as
people make them out to be -- they weren't too impressed by the VSR either 
-- they recommend their own 3.0 and 3.1 conversions, EIP head and intake, 
with Genie headers & exhaust -- quoted dyno figures of 258 hp for their 3.1
 -- recommended I look into a Quaiffe, also should consider improving the 
suspension and brakes to match the engine...

Ron's Parts said that the Abt 3.1 kit is a solid product, though they've
heard 
good things about the EIP conversions too --they recommend Schrick cams
and a Supersprint exhaust to go with that -- also suggested I  upgrade to a 
Sachs clutch, Wilwood brakes, Spax adjustable suspension -- 250-300hp 
is possible in their opinion...

New Dimensions did not recommend stroker or bored motors, mentioned none
of these conversions are street legal (incl. cams and headers) -- they said
not to 
believe a lot of these quoted figures as they have dynoed the 3.1 at only
170hp -- 
they suggested I wait for their turbo kit which will have more power, won't
involve 
tearing down the block, and be emissions-legal -- they expect to squeeze up
to 
300hp from the turbo...

Have yet to speak to Neuspeed, Techtonics, Autotech, or Eurosport...

Well, most of the tuners are telling me the Abt 3.1 kit is the best, so I'm
leaning 
that way -- but am worried about the legality of this conversion as I live in
Southern 
California -- should I wait for the turbo, or just be prepared to pay someone
under 
the counter to pass inspection?

And if I go with the Abt conversion, AMS tells me I should go with them as
their
shop has the most VR6 experience on the West Coast (no one else local has 
converted a VR6) -- they have already done several of these conversions plus
have
dyno and custom chip programming facilities -- also their projects have been
featured
in European Car -- so they seem a good choice -- anyone dealt with them
before?

So, what do you folks think -- any help or suggestions would be most
appreciated...

Jimmy aka VR6Maniac


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Feb 14 18:08 PST 1996
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Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 21:02:39 -0500
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: Re: Oettinger 3.1, PIAA 1200/1000, Euro Lights, Suko cams, Euro 2.9.
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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*******************************************************
>Euro Lights : NO EURO LIGHTS AT GTA! 
>so no European lights till 4 weeks

   Not supposed to let the cat out of the bag, but EIP is expecting a
delivery within the next week or so.  Of course I don't know how many units
are in the shipment or whether they have all been allocated, but it's worth a
try - just be prepared to be disappointed by their availability as I'm sure
they'll go FAST...

>GTA told me that Sukos are great, cuz hallow and light... "Yes, 
>but are they brittle, weak?", I said... he replyed "No they are not, 
>they had been tested severely and passed the tests ; they are as solid 
>as rock 

   I'm sure that the Sukos (as sold under the Abt brand) are fine, reliable
performance cams. It's just that I've heard stories from a couple of
well-known tuners about problems with these cams on other (non-VR6) engines
used for racing (i.e. at high revs), so I just stayed with the reputable
Schricks myself. However, GTA and AMS swear by the Sukos...  As for the issue
of an increased rev potential resulting from a lighter camshaft, I personally
don't believe that it is as significant a factor in this application at
revolutions below 7000 rpm since most of this weight difference is at the
centre axis of rotation rather than at the outer components such as valves
(from my limited understanding of automobile and Newtonian mechanics).

> "ONLY the P-flow does nothing, except sound... 
>If you want to have sound, ok, buy it, or else, you'll buy it for 
>nothing..."

   That's quite correct, I believe that the P-Flow BY ITSELF will at best net
you an incredible 1-2hp at the top end. Actually you may end up losing a few
hp down low with the P-Flow because of decreased air velocity vs stock, and
breathing in hotter air from around the engine!  But, oh, that gorgeous howl
at full throttle (for those who like that effect anyway )...

>	I'll have to revise all over the mods I wanted to do... shit, 
>I'm getting crazy for all the time I'm passing on gathering infos each 
>day (maybe I'm already crazy...!) ;-) and trying to find the best mod 
>for me... Anyway, I don't have the choice, cuz they're the only one 
>around here who can maintain correctly my car...

   Hang in there, Frank, it's very difficult to maintain an objective
perspective when everyone is telling you something different or if someone
has a hidden agenda.  There are many ardent but often conflicting opinions
readily offered out there, and it can become quite confusing!  Just be
patient, don't despair, and keep up your enthusiasm and research. 

   In life, we often have to dilute our visions and dreams because reality
intrudes (i.e. hard earned money that should really go towards rent and the
basics of life instead of nifty toys and such), but compromises are not all
bad.  Sounds like you need to have someone reliable, competent and LOCAL to
support all the maintenance work for your mods, so if you're happy with GTA's
quality of work, integrity and treatment of their customers (which you seem
to be), by all means stick with them and be content with your decision to do
so, even if you have to revise your original plans somewhat...

   Alright, alright, end of pseudo-philosophical lecture.  Remember, enjoy
and live life to the fullest!!!   :o)

Cheers,
Edward
8 days and counting...


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Jun 11 08:03 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 11 Jun 1996 05:57:06 -0400
From: rkoturbash@helixvc.com
Subject: You're not going to believe this
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     Corvettes beware.  Vipers run for cover.  Even the mighty Porsche 993 
     Turbo and Ferrari F355 can't compete.  This thing makes Ed's 3.1 look 
     like an economy hatch back (joke).  The Beast from the East is now 
     just a feast.  Let me explain.
     
     I just picked up the Option Auto magazine (it's in French so I 
     couldn't translate the whole article) but it has a 1993 PAC Racing 
     Corrado VR6 Turbo pumping out . . . you're not going to believe this . 
     . . 487.7 horsepower at the front wheels.  Yes, that's 487!!!  This 
     thing is so modified at first glance I didn't even notice it was a 
     Corrado.  Let's start with the mundane stuff first.  Full Zender 
     ground effects, including replacement front and rear bumpers, side 
     skirts and rear wing.  17 inch 5 spoke wheels (Azev Type C??) running 
     235/40ZR17's all the way around.  Eibach and Bilstein suspension.  
     Absolutely huge 4 caliper AP Racing 13" discs on the front.  The hood 
     looks like swiss cheese!  An enormous intercooler is blended in on the 
     drivers side with an opening about 4" tall by 12" wide.  Small 
     triangular sections have been cut out from the hood above the engine.  
     The thing looks completely insane.
     
     Here comes the good part . .. the engine is bored out and is running 
     92 mm pistons up from 91 mm that also lower the compression ratio.  3" 
     polished aluminum intake ducting runs to a huge intercooler mounted 
     beside the engine.  Battery must have ended up in the trunk.  The car 
     runs a Garrett T4 turbo, and the air to air intercooler features a 
     water injection system to further cool the compressed air.  The crank 
     has been nitrided for additional strength.  I'm sure many other 
     changes were made to the engine but I can't catch them all, my french 
     isn't all that good.
     
     The gearbox is a Volkswagen motorsport Rallye gearbox with an 
     absolutely wild DTM style push forward to change up pull back to 
     change down gearshift lever that is 15 cm taller than the stock C 
     shifter.  It comes up to where the radio would normally be (stripped 
     out on this car to save weight probably).  Incidentally, the 
     transmission ALONE costs 60000 Francs.  The car also uses a racing 
     clutch that needs to be replaced every 10000 km.  NUTS!!!
     
     How does it perform?  Apparently the car can spin the tires up to 
     180km/h (not sure, it's that French thing again!) and with revised 
     gearing has a top speed of 278km/h.  No acceleration times had yet 
     been recorded.  The car was detuned to only 380hp! at 15 psi boost for 
     street use (I think, not sure).  It makes 487 dyno verified front 
     wheel horsepower at 21 psi boost.
     
     The thing is so insane that 18" flames shoot out the twin exhausts 
     during downshifts!!  Looks really cool with the burgundy metallic 
     paint job.
     
     Anyway, I'm sure there's a ton of stuff about the car I missed in my 
     rough translation that maybe Frank wants to help out on.  Apparently 
     the impetus of this project was that the guy got blown away by a new 
     Euro M3 and was out for revenge.  Beware . . . 
     
     Rob
     93 SLC (down 300 horsepower!)

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Jun 13 14:07 PDT 1996
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Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 13:59:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jan Vandenbrande 
Subject: Re: Timing is everything (fwd)
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> Jan Vandenbrande wrote:
> >> PS: This will NOT work on the VR6/SLCs...you cannot twist the distributor.
> > Bummer.
> 
> seriously tho, IS there any way (or reason) to mechanically adjust the 
> timing on the motronic system as a means of squeezing out horsepower 
> that might be lurking there? 

"Any way"...not sure as I have not looked at how the timing stuff is
picked up on VR6s. However, if you look at some motor bikes with "fixed"
ignition excitors, you can buy these after market ones which look like
a Z (vs  __ ) to advance the timing. I immagine it's conceivable
to do something like that, or figure out a way to reposition the 
pick up sensor.

"Reason"...yes and no...it's all in the chips nowadays, so in principle
that's the way to go. However, I believe that due to EPA regulations
the tuners cannot advance timing all that much between idle and 2500 rpm
and still pass any of the certifications.

> does the system, coupled with the knock sensor, always keep the timing 
> at optimum advance? 

I read somewhere that it does not. It'll only advance so much but could
go much further in many cases (how else do you think Aaron, Marc, etc
are able to market these chips?). ANd that's also why you can manually
advance ignition by a couple degrees w/o knock (G60, the old 85-87
8V GTIs, etc) and benefit.

> and are there any gains to be had by dialing in the cams to adjust valve 
> timing as can be done in older VW's to shift your power curve?

Interesting idea. Most likely it will work, however...you now have
to deal with two cam shafts *and* your timing is attached to one of
the camshafts for the VR6 (and 16V) engines. So you got 3 parameters
to play with. Tricky.

Extra Credit Question: What about a centrifugal device that 
advances/retards cam shaft timing (actually, I think they used
to exist).

(For those that don't know, you *can* advance/retard your cam and
what that does is move the max torque point along the rpm curve. 
Cam advance gives you more low end, retard more top end, though in
both cases, peak Hp may not change that much. I accidentally tried
it and it really changes the feel *and* sound of the engine).

> one reason i ask is that i have the Autotech Q-chip installed and notice 
> what seems to be a flat spot at 2000-2500 rpm at partial throttle. 

Interesting...that may be the spot where the EPA regulates things.
Darn, I can't remember who I talked to, but he said
"We really cannot do much below 2500 rpm due to the EPA". 
Dont know if that's true or not. Anyone know?


> applying full throttle to correct this does nothing to improve the rpm 
> climb. could it be the knock sensor reining in the q-chip? or is it just 
> flat compared to all the improvement elsewhere?  this is with 93 chevron 
> octane and i've noticed no improvement when octane booster ("104+" 
> brand) is added (as an aside, i did notice a bit of coughing and 
> spitting when i put a bottle of techron in along with a tankful of 93 
> chevron recently). but this got me wondering if the system logic is as 
> good at advancing the timing to take advantage of super high octane as 
> it is as retarding it to protect the engine.

>From what I understand how these things work...the chip maps rpm/load/temps
etc into an advance angle. If the ECU now detects knock, it will retard
it first by N degrees, then move up (N/2, N/4 or something like that)
for each successive ignition.

So if you want to make max use of advance, you'd have to program your
advance to be at knock and have the feedback mechanism kick in.
However, that also means that you'd have to detect knock from time
to time, which is really not that great for engine durability.
So those chips are generally a couple degrees below the knock
point to allow engine and gas quality variations.

Naturally, you can also immagine a different system where the system
advances timing until the knock point, but that wont work because
your car would constantly try to accelerate with constant throttle
position.


--
             o  ___|___   [\\]    | Jan Vandenbrande jan@ug.eds.com
   __0   /\0/  /-------\     _    | http://alicudi.usc.edu:80/~jan/ 
   \<,_ O  \\ (_________) .#/_\_. | Autoracing, mountain climbing and running
(_)/ (_)   // [_]     [_] |_(_)_| | of the bulls are sports, the rest are games

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Jun 19 07:16 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 18 Jun 1996 23:59:50 -0400
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Re: RMR Autosport and EIP's 3.1
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I have been unable to read my mail for some time do to the preparations we
are making for the upcoming Import Shoot-out on July 4th. The Turbo system
for the Corrado is nearly complete, we will Dyno testing very soon. I have
just recently read some of the "Controversy" that some have been involved in
as to VR6 HP and such. With out being long winded, and to get directly to the
point, I welcome ANYONE to come down when we dyno test our latest 3.1 Engine
that is sitting snugly in an A-2 GTI chassis. We expect to reach slightly
higher numbers than with our last 3.1 which repeatedly pulled over 250 HP AT
THE FRONT WHEELS. Several people have suggested that Dyno results can be
"faked or altered" to show higher numbers than the engine is actually
producing. This may be possible but I really wouldn’t know. EIP at present
does not have an in-house dyno. We work with Autothority on cutom e-prom
tuning and Dyno testing our various project cars. As I have stated before,
APE for all intents and purposes is a third party impartial tuner who
performed many repeated dyno runs with one of our 3.1L projects. They are
soon going to be testing another 3.1L which we expect "bigger and better
things" from. As for testing or racing Ed Thai’s car to try and prove it’s
performance, that is TOTALLY up to Ed, after all it is his car, not EIP’s. I
don’t think that the Quarter mile is a very acurate way to measure HP but if
it’s any indication, our in house (Steve’s) ’92 C with our fully built EIP
3.0L engine package runs 13.9 second quarter mile runs, when it isn’t
shearing drive shafts in half (3 to date). We were able (before Ed picked up
his car) to run Ed’s 3.1L car several times (not at the track) against
Steve’s 3.0L …the results : Ed’s car would pull steadily on Steve’s car
through fourth gear at which time they seemed to level out. Ed’ car would hit
the rev limiter (6800 at that time) in Fifth gear and Steve would then begin
creeping by Ed’s 3.1L. Ed’s car would probably end up about three cars in
front of Steve’s in a Quarter mile contest which we can guess would be about
3 tenths in a quarter mile. 
This is all I have time for at this time, I will try to answer any questions
and respond to everyone’s comments in the next few days. Remember, virtually
ALL successful racing efforts and high perfromance street engines use FORGED
PISTONS !!!!! 
C U LTR
---------> RICH !! <---------   


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Wed Jun 26 15:41 PDT 1996
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Date: Wed, 26 Jun 1996 17:59:26 +0000
From: cgade@hallam.com
Subject: Souped G60 and SLC 3.1 list of mods...
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     I have witnessed the below Corrados.  Although I cannot vouch for 
     every piece of hardware, I am convinced it has been implemented, not 
     theorized. (the glass pack exhaust and tinted rear tail lights were 
     removed for the C's return to England...)  Again, the SLC has returned 
     to England with the young owner and I have no contact with him. 
     
     I'm working on getting the time trial numbers.
     
     I am providing the following list for your entertainment only and not 
     mine.  I have nothing to gain for posting false information to a group 
     I admire.  I welcome comments.
     
     enjoy
     
     Chris
     Vermont
     93 SLC
     
     ********************************************************
     
     1993 VW Corrado SLC, Flash Red
     
     Engine Parts:
     Akimoto funnel-ram air filter with tornado insert
     Euro 2.91 T-body
     VSR
     ABT 6-3-2-1 header
     straight pipe replaces suitcase muffler
     Sebring glass-pack muffler
     AMS custom ECU PROM
     Neuspeed 8mm plug wires
     Splitfire plugs
     180 degree thermostat and fan switch
     Borg/Warner/Neuspeed oil cooler
     Reworked oil pan
     ABT 278 cams
     ABT 3.1 liter kit crank, pistons...
     Titanium valve springs and retainers
     Carillo connecting rods
     EIP 3mm oversize valves, exhausts are sodium filled
     
     Engine Assembly:
     Racing valve job
     block shaved for an 11:1 compression ratio
     extrude-honed intake runner to match head
     polished T-body 
     Cylinder head ported and polished, valve pockets machined
     ABT lightened crank, polished and balanced
     block painted blue
     
     Transaxle:
     
     lightened flywheel
     Quaife 
     taller 5th gear from European Corrado
     Neuspeed short shift kit
     stock clutch
     
     Brakes:
     red calipers
     ferodo brake pads
     braided steel lines
     rotors drilled and chamfered
     
     Suspension:
     Eibach front strut tower brace
     Eibach lowering springs
     Bilstein Sport shocks
     Neuspeed 25mm front sway bar
     Neuspeed 28mm rear sway bar
     17x8 OZ Monte Carlo wheels
     215/40ZR17 Continental CV91
     
     Exterior:
     Euro Air dam
     PIAA 100 fogs
     Euro Headlights
     Bra
     Zender rear spoiler
     side turn signals
     rolled rear fenders
     
     Interior:
     Momo Monte Carlo steering wheel
     Momo Elegance shift knob
     Ottinger floor mats
     ....MBQuartz ...
     ....Cell phone...
     
     ***********************************************************
     1990 Corrado  G60
     
     Engine:
     Neuspeed HP Kit
     68mm pulley
     Gillet exhaust
     Gen2 fuel enrichment kit
     PCHIP
     Neuspeed 260 cam
     K&N filter in stick box
     
     Suspension:
     Autotech adjustable front tower brace
     Tokica Illumina 5-way adjustable shocks
     15x7 MSW type 18
     205/50ZR15 SP8000
     
     Exterior:
     Euro Headlights
     VR6 grill
     Clear turn indicators
     shaved rear fenders
     G60 logos removed
     bra
     Deer whistles mounted beneath bumper
     
     Interior:
     ....Rear ashtray replaces by water bottle...
     

From owner-corrado-l@TELEPORT.COM Wed Jun 26 01:04 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 11:38:40 +0000
From: cgade@hallam.com
Subject: Souped G60 vs Souped 3.1 SLC
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     Now don't go bashing me for lack of hard data cuz I'll get it if I 
     have to but...
     
     Local UVM student (actually related in some way to Jordanian Royalty 
     which meant his bank account was unlimited) in the Vermont area has 
     (since moved back to England) a 93 SLC 3.1 from ABT with all the mods: 
     3.1, VSR, exhaust, suspension, wheels, lights, brakes, tint, 
     stickers.... you name it.
     
     Good friend of his and since friend of mine who owns a 90 G60 with a 
     fuel enrichment kit, suspension, rims, smaller pulley... pretty basic 
     mods.  Now this guy is a fanatic motorcycle race head (rebuilding his 
     race bike in the living room) and thus knows a thing or two about time 
     trials and such...
     
     G60 vs 3.1 in various time trials such as 0-60, 5-60, 1/4 mile, 60-80 
     and whatever else the standard get-up-n-go is.
     
     THE G60 beat the 3.1 CONSISTENTLY! 
     
     I spoke (man he likes to talk!) with the G60 owner and he has all the 
     time trial stuff on a printout and I'll try to get a hold of it and 
     send it to everyone (except Ed).  I know this guy and I would trust 
     his wristwatch time trials to be accurate and fair.
     
     I'm just passing along what I have heard for you geeks...  
     
     Chris
     Vermont
     93 SLC
     
     PS Apparently the SLC owner was livid at the results, but the SLC 
     sounded better.  Again, I'll try to substantiate this bandwidth with 
     some numbers...

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Jun 27 14:02 PDT 1996
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Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 09:30:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: corrado@intermind.net (Michael Balasko)
Subject: THE MANIFOLD
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  A while ago, I wrote about the Schrick VSR manifold. Welp, I have a 
few numbers, and can only say that more testing needs to be done before
I can get all of the numbers. Test Car has P-flo, chip, throttle body.

Here is the partial dyno chart, I am in the process of getting the complete
chart for you guys. 
4000rpm, up 4hp
5000rpm, up 7hp
7000rpm, No shit, this is not a mistype 17hp(thats seventeen.)

I still have to get the lower RPM chart and post it, but I was eager
to share the results with you. It seems that the manifold is the
best design out as it adds to low end(Not as much as the VWMosport though),
and doesn't take away from it(Like the EIP) but add more hp than the EIP
does at the top end too.
One thing must be done with the manifold is a new chip must be 
programmed for it and thus more testing must be done then. 
It seems that the car runs lean even with a P-chip. I'll keep you posted 
as I get more info.


Take care, 

Mike "the preliminary info guy"


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Jun 27 00:28 PDT 1996
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Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 00:28:43 -0400
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Re: 1/4 mile times from EIP shootout please
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In a message dated 96-06-21 23:09:44 EDT, you write:

>Those of you going to the July 4th event, could you please send me some of
>the E.T.s?  What would really help is if you found out what people have
>under the hood vs. what kind of times they're getting.  You know do the,
>"hey what you got in there?  Oh yeah?  Who's chip?  Who's Cam, etc" and
>then see what they run?
>
>This will help me out a lot as it will tell me a lot about the 1/4 mile
>potential of the mods.  I want to hit the 14s, but do not want to do much
>more than the AT chip and pulley that I already have.  I'm running 15.1 and
>I'm hoping that a t-body would do it for me.

 Just as a teaser, our customer who we did the 3.1L VR6 A-2 for, recently ran
his car with some friends of his who have a Vericom performance computer.
Just to explain it's accuracy, the guys who set it up for him run 11 & 12
second Grand Nationals and state the Vericom as being accurate within 1
hundredth of a second and a 10th of a mile per hour. With 17" wheels/tires
spinning through third gear, Stuart the owner of the 3.1L managed several
runs at 14.3 seconds @ 105 MPH !! The ET sucks but 105 is pretty damn
impressive. We expect much better times with 15" wheels/tires set up for
racing. Guess we’ll see 7/4/96.

------> RICH <------ 


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sun Jun 30 18:46 PDT 1996
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Date: Sun, 30 Jun 1996 21:24:42 -0400
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Forged vs. Cast cont.
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In a message dated 96-06-27 11:39:38 EDT, you write:

>Does Edwards car consume oil? I thought I caught a post about it 
>recently, but could be wrong.
>
>

Yes Ed’s car does consume oil…for now. One of the things that we are doing
for Ed besides more performance mods, is replace his pistons with our latest
VR6 piston design (at no cost to Ed) which has significantly reduced oil
consumption. In fact Steve’s 3.0L uses less than 1 qt in 3k miles. Our latest
3.1L used less than 1 qt. During break in (2k miles) and has used ˝ qt in the
last 3k miles. It currently has about 5k on the engine.

>For a normally aspirated street motor 
>they are not required.

This point is very debatable. A 300 hp VR6 engine isn’t required either but
the demand is still there. What are you basing the assumption that forged
pistons are not a necessary part of our 3.1L engine. Many decisions were made
when we started to design the 3.1L VR6 engine upgrade. One of those included
the decision to go with forged pistons. We have produced a 3.1L engine that
produces 300hp,  runs on pump gas, gets 24+ mpg, is emissions legal, has
stock like drive-ability, and is as quiet as a mouse. This is something that
few others, VW tuners or otherwise, have achieved. Sure we could have used
inexpensive, easy to use cast pistons. We could have chosen a mild path, like
many others, and bought ABT’s kit, but that is not our style. We choose to
take an aggressive and challenging path. We wanted more and our custom forged
pistons are an important part of the process. Let’s bear in mind that ABT
claims 240hp at the crank, EIP has repeatedly proven over 250 hp at the front
wheels.

>Please fill us in on how your design works (unless it's a family secret). 
>Do these coating reduce the working temperature of the piston and there 
>by the amount it expands in the bore? What needs to be taken in to acount 
>when the pistons size is increased 2mm? Do you have to change the design 
>of the dish in the top?

I can’t give away all of our secretes, but you assume correctly in the fact
that reduced temperatures have a lot to do with it. As for the piston design,
many many factors were taken into account when doing the design work here. We
have achieved an excellent design and work with an excellent piston
manufacturer. After the pistons are finished they are pin fitted to EIP’s
custom alloy pins. They are then shipped to EIP for more work that is done by
hand to each piston. They are then sent out for the high performance coatings
to be applied. The result is the best VR6 pistons available anywhere. All of
this is not required if we wanted to simply install bolt on parts but it is
all very necessary to achieve the high levels of performance that we continue
to improve upon.   

>Tell me, why does VW use cast pistons in their normally aspirated 
>motors?? I've seen some of these cast piston mnotors go 400k without a 
>bottom end rebuild, and only use a quart every thousand. Why does a 
>street motor that can only spin 7k RPM need a super lightweight piston?

I suppose that VW, as with many auto manufacturers, use cast pistons because
they are very easy to produce in large quantities, are low maintenance. They
are also very inexpensive when compared to forged units. In fact, I would
recommend cast pistons to those whose only interest is in the engines
longevity and oil consumption figures and are not concerned with performance.
As I said before, the weight of the forged pistons is not a very important
factor, it is the many other advantages of our forged pistons that greatly
outweigh (as we have proven on the dyno) any liabilities. 

>Although I have tried to figure out how your manifold works, I can't recall 
>anyone on the list trying to figure out the secrets of your big valve 
>head. Does your intake make 10 hp on a 2.8 or a 3.0? You said you had to 
>redesign it like 10 times? or something. Which leads me to believe you 
>could not at first explain it. So you cut it apart and experimented on a 
>flow bench. So why bash me for trying?

I wasn’t referring directly to you but rather to the countless posts that I
read that refer to where our intake helps, where it hurts, and how it
compares to the VSR. If you are taking the time to research the intake and
how it works etc. I commend you. At least you will have some understanding
from which to base your comments. The fact is, our intake loses ZERO velocity
over stock (which could cause a bit of torque loss) and increases power all
the way through the power band. Yes there are bigger gains in the upper mid
range and top end areas but that is where the most power is made anyway.  Yet
I have read numerous times on how our intake is based for the upper end only
while the VSR is better for low end. NOT TRUE. We flow tested the VSR with
it’s flap in various positions, none of which helped it breath nearly as
efficiently as ours. Yes it provides a spike at 3k rpm's then drops below
stock in hp. Also we balance our intake manifold allowing each cylinder to
have an even balance of air.  
 
>This doesn’t sound bitter, but rather condescending to me. It makes me 
>feel as though you don't think I can or want to understand this stuff. 
>Although you did want to offer me some input on the manifold diagram I 
>obtained (and have yet to send out to everyone). I'm confused.

As I explained above, I commend you on your attempts to uncover the intake
manifold mystery. As I told you when we spoke before, I am curious as to what
you have discovered and am willing to offer some suggestions. I don’t have
any way of judging whether or not you are capable of understanding how the
flow patterns work inside of theVR6 manifold. You certainly seem intelligent
and capable enough to learn, I assure you I wasn’t criticizing you. I don’t
consider myself a rocket scientist or anything, in fact what I (we) am doing
here at EIP is to simply design something then test it and redesign and
re-test it until it’s right. Whether it be a VR6 intake or a custom set of
intake valves.  I think it is our dedication to VW performance that makes us
special, not the size of our brains, although I do test well on an ink blot
test (ha ha). 

Well, talk to you soon, send me a copy of the intake stuff that you have.
I’ll at least give you some input as to the accuracy of your findings.

--------> RICH !! <-------- 


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Fri Jul  5 21:41 PDT 1996
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Date: Sat, 06 Jul 1996 00:37:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Schrick intake install
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Well I recieved my intake, installed it, I like it! Have a few problems 
to work out still, but they are minor.

Power (torque) starts building around 2400 RPM, by 3200 you know somthing 
is definetly different. This lump of torque climbs to 4200, then the 
valve is supposed to open. I don't think opens until 5700, but I can 
adjust the control box for this. From 4200 to 5700 RPM it's kind of flat 
as a result (I beleive?). around 5800 another lump of power starts a 
build'n, and promptly slams you into the 7200 RPM rev limiter! FUN!

I'll give a complete rundown on everything (hopfully that flat spot will 
get resolved) in a few days. Off to H2O fest in the morning.

Later

Brian 93 VR6 C

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Jul  9 20:03 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 09 Jul 1996 18:27:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Schrick manifold
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Well, I found the cause of the 4200 - 5800 flat spot. Turns out this is 
where the car is running lean. I think Mike supplied this info earlier.
So RPI is working with Schrick to develope a chip. Should be ready by the 
end of the month. They are also trying to wire the manifold so it runs 
directly from the computer. Right now it has it's own control box.

The manifold is really awesome in every other RPM range. This thing 
pulls! Unfortunatly that damn flat spot is right where the RPMs drop into 
after a run to redline. Really annoying, I think there's less power 
through this range than stock! It allows lesser tuned VRs to keep up. 

I can tell you though, if the chip wipes out this problem, this will be 
the most hp and torque I've managed to muster from a single bolt on. 

I'll keep everyone updated!

Later

Brian

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Jul 11 01:47 PDT 1996
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Date: Wed, 10 Jul 1996 19:47:22 -0400
From: Frank 
Subject: 487hp Turbo C VR6 translation now OVER!
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: Corrado-l-digest 
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As Sormani explained to me, the VR6 engine has an excellent block that
is relatively easy to optimize. Thus, the turbocharger (the famous Garrett T4 that
is used on the Renault R5 Turbo II and the Peugeot T16 Evolution 2) did not
present major problems, though it did require a few hundred hours of work. At
this power level, however, practically each engine component needed to be revised.
To fit a turbo, the first course of action was to reduce the compression ratio,
which increases the combustion-chamber volume. To accomplish this, Philippe Sormani
began by modifying the connecting rods and wrist pins. Naturally, the stock pistons
were replaced by forged ones (with a modest re-bore to 82 mm, compared to the
original 81-mm bore), while the connecting rod and crank surfaces were nitrided
in order to improve their strength. All of the stock rubber hoses in the cooling
water system were converted to silicone materials and the oil lines were replaced
with ones fabricated from armored aerospace tubing. The radiator was revised and
now consists of two stock radiators welded together. The air intake is now direct,
in order to feed the turbocharger, and uses a JR Competition oversized filter
designed for 500+ horsepower systems. Because of the addition of the turbo system,
naturally the exhaust system had to be redesigned, complete with a new, German-made
exhaust manifold and 70-mm diameter all-stainless exhaust tubing. But, the most
impressive change remains the air-to-air intercooler that covers more than
one-third of the engine bay ! It even includes a special fan and a water injector
that can be triggered from the dashboard in the event of overheating.

	Appropriately, the dashboard has evolved as well. It has integrated every
gauge imaginable ; thus the modification of the ABS light to include a rev limiter
warning light. At the focus of the driver's attention is the turbo boost gauge.
When the needle reads 1.5 bar, there are 487 horsepower at the front wheels at
6500 rpm (maximum torque is 398 ft-lbs at 4500 rpm). For reliability reasons, the
turbo pressure for the break-in period has been limited to 1.0 bar by adjusting the
turbo wastegate, so for the break-in period the maximum power is 380 hp at 6500 rpm.

next...

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Jul 11 01:45 PDT 1996
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Date: Wed, 10 Jul 1996 19:48:04 -0400
From: Frank 
Subject: 487hp Turbo C VR6 translation now OVER!
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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To transmit this demonic power to the wheels, the entire transmission had=

to be examined and revised. The stock gearbox was replaced with a VW Moto=
rsport
box ($7456 to $9320 US manufacturer's price) with linkages used in rally-=
cross.
The changes are evident in the monstrous shifter that towers some 15 cm h=
igher
than the stock shifter. In order to fit the big shifter, they had to cut =
a little
in the plastic cover where KARMANN is written. The gearing has been thoro=
ughly
revised and some custom reinforcing pads have been carved at PAC Racing b=
ecause
the stock rally-cross box pulled too hard in the lower gears. The higher =
gear
ratios have been selected to limit the top speed to 247 km/h (153 mph) at=
 8000 rpm.
The gearbox is connected to the engine via a steel twin-disc clutch with =
copper
pad (not sure if it=92s the right word) similar to those used in rally ca=
rs as this
is the only clutch capable of transmitting the power. The one drawback : =
the
clutch life expectancy is 10,000 kilometers.

	Finally, the power is transmitted to the road through special CV joints
(roughly twice the diameter of stock) to the 235/40 ZR17 rubber. Any wide=
r and the
tires rubbed dangerously against the fenders.

	To minimize as much as possible the burn-out (laborious when we shift in=
to
4th at 112mph [180km/h]), the wheel hubs have been modified, and the fron=
t wheel
caster angle sensibly increased (it increases traction). As far as the su=
spension
is concerned, springs and shocks have of course been changed (re-caliber =
Bilstein,
and Eibach springs), and a complete specially welded front triangulation/=
A-arm
has been adapted into the body. Moreover, the =ABmachine=BB is now equipp=
ed with a
mechanical anti-lock (probably a mechanical differential), which will unl=
ock on
acceleration. To correctly slow down the beast, from the speeds obtained =
by the
engine fury, the whole braking system has been also revised. The front wh=
eels
now have 320-mm (12.57 inches) discs (there were none bigger) special-cas=
t,
slotted, with AP Racing's 4-pot piston calipers, and the rear stock discs=
 have
been cross-drilled.

next...

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Jul 11 01:42 PDT 1996
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Date: Wed, 10 Jul 1996 19:46:12 -0400
From: Frank 
Subject: 487hp Turbo C VR6 translation now OVER!
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: Corrado-l-digest 
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In few parts.

A 487hp Corrado : it exists !

	This car is a monster. Rarely had we been that far in what we call "street
tuning". All this to beat M3s !

(Zender spoiler kits, Zender rear wing)

	487 hp available, all this simply to settle an old dispute with an M3.

	To catch the gearbox shifter, put your arm out straight horizontal...
there you have it.

Acceleration is demonic and the wheelspin finally stops in fifth gear. The
ventilated hood permits the engine to breath a bit.

	Downshifts are punctured with flames !

Under the hood, you see that all this power comes from an engine
compartment with no room to spare.

	Life is tough. Consider Mr. Charlery's emotions: the innocent owner of
a basic VR6, with which he did a few wide-open acceleration runs on the only
straight 1.86+ mile highway on the island. One day, while beginning his little
daily burn-out at 7:30 AM, his favorite car was thoroughly trounced by a vulgar
metallic-colored late-model M3. In a heartbeat, war was immediately and officially
declared : this challenge had to be met.

	Mr. Charlery called Christophe Sormani, his faithful tuner and Director
of PAC Racing, to tell him that the Corrado was already on its way in a cargo
plane, and that PAC Racing had to think about a little pep pill that could permit
him to be assured of complete vengeance. Never used to doing things halfway, and
still devastated by his bad adventure, Mr. Charlery set his sights on a
450-horsepower Corrado, with FWD.

next...

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat Jul 27 17:29 PDT 1996
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Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 20:25:32 -0400
From: UniqueVR6@aol.com
Subject: * TURBO VR6 *
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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[this is being posted from my old AOL account as 
I'm currently on the East Coast.  Won't be able to
check/read any corrado-l posts or my email 
until I get back to the SF Bay Area after August 4th.
Please do not reply to this account as I've re-activated
it temporarily just to post this piece of news (I won't 
have access to a computer for the next week or so).
I'll catch up with everything when I get back to California,
and will surely post more of my cross-country experiences!

Edward
corblimy@creative.net

****************************************************************
  @$#%*!)+@%#$  Blooming heck, I knew I shouldn't 
have made the pilgrimage to EIP!  As if outrunning a
tornado in Oklahoma (wonder if things would have 
turned out differently if we had been in a stock 2.8  ;o)
and surviving an unplanned detour through a redneck 
town in Arkansas where everyone seemed to be 
driving pickup trucks with gun-racks weren't enough,
little did we anticipate what awaited us in Eldersburg, MD.

   It all started innocently enough when I accepted Steve's
offer to check out his 3.0L C., smug in the assumption
that his car, amazingly fast as it probably was, would
be a couple of notches below my 3.1 in performance levels.

  Well, the brutish roar of his VR6 was the first sign that
this was quite an unique motor indeed, to be swiftly 
confirmed when we found ourselves careening through
twisty, curvy backroads far in excess of 100 mph!  Built as
a top end machine that's comfortable at 155mph (though
Rich still enjoys giving Steve a hard time over some of his 
past quarter mile performances ), this C.runs 
devastatingly fast (especially with Steve behind the wheels),
having humiliated more than its fair share of strutting
muscle cars, rice burners and their ilk.

  Next Stu drops by in his extremely tricked out 3.1L A2
Golf, and before I could say "EIP", I'm flung backwards by
a tidal wave of massive torque as his improved 3.1 (probably
version 2.0 vs my v0.99 beta!) screams through the gears.
Blimey, definitely the fastest VW I've ever been in, I mutter
to myself with respect and more than a twinge of envy...

  But the best was yet to come, as Rich pulls up next to us
on the shoulder in a smart looking green C., complete with
passenger.  The gauntlet is immediately thrown, and I find 
myself slammed once again to my seat.  Stu edges slightly
forward in the first second, both cars remain practically level
through 3rd gear, and then incredibly enough, the C. starts
pulling away from the 3.1 A2 steadily all the way from there!!!

  Heck, what's in that C., a 3.1 VR6 on the bottle???!  Well,
all is revealed when I have the chance to sit in that C.,
immediately noticing a couple of gauges with the telltale
lettering "Boost" and "Exhaust Temp"...ah, the long-awaited
* eip TURBO VR6 *!

  "We're still playing around with a few things, the car's currently
only running 7 to 8 psi on the factory cams, pistons and chip,
we'll get it up to a production 10-12 psi with a 15 lbs boost option"
Rich explains apologetically as he nonchantly runs lighteningly 
fast through the Eurospec 6-speed gearbox. Without any fuss
or roughness, the 2.8 turbo just spools up effortlessly and
creamy smooth as the C hurtles towards (and beyond) the
160 mph indication accompanied by an eerily whisper of a whoosh.

  I can't believe it, it just seems too easy as we repeatedly sweep 
the speedometer needle to its pinned position at will, no sluggish
lag followed by an uncontrolled burst of power, instead just an 
inexorable rush above 3000rpm that retains the deceptively smooth 
characteristics of the stock VR6!!   I knew I shouldn't have 
experienced this stealthy forced induction beast, for I now reluctantly
realise that my torquey, speedy 3.1 has, at long last, met its match...

Cheers,
Edward

P.S.  More goodies to come in the next installment, including my
experiences with the eip "vw rat pack" on the highway (oh, that 
sweet chorus of simultaneous singing VR6s unleashed at full
throttle!), and the impressive collection of eip-modified cars
including Dave's turbo VR6 C. (soon to be integrated with nitrous!),
Stu's 3.1 VR6 A2 Gti (50% Corrado parts), Steve's wicked 3.0 C.,
Calvin's Euro 2.9L VR6 A1 Rabbit (with a turbo future planned),
Tom's 2.2L 16v tall block Jetta GLI, Jim's 4-door VR6 Golf GL,
Rich's White ABT body kit VR6 Golf, Drew's sneaky 16v Scirocco,
and more...

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Thu Aug  1 16:12 PDT 1996
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Date: Thu, 01 Aug 1996 16:06:22 -0700
From: mything@ix.netcom.com (Gerald T Fukui)
Subject: EIP TURBO VR6
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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    Hello to all the Corrado Connoisseur's, I would like to give you my 
thoughts on EIP's Turbo VR6.  I was the co-driver that accommodated 
Edward Thai across country to EIP, I might also mention that I did the 
majority of the driving Edward.
    Upon arriving at EIP we were greeted by Steve he his the owner of 
the EIP 3.0 his Corrado is very distinct in sound and for those of you 
who have been to EIP you know what I mean. If anyone ever wants to see 
the limits of a Corrado Steve is the man.  His Corrado is capable of 
160 mph I know this for a fact because I had the pleasure to ride in 
his Corrado.  Steve had warned me that if you ride in the Turbo you 
will have to buy one it is that impressive.
    I also had the pleasure to see another EIP project car that belongs 
to Stuart Moulton.  He is the owner of a A2 golf that has a 3.1 with a 
Corrado dash.  This corrado is a show car and I hope that EC will do a 
article on his A2 golf.  This A2 is extremely clean and Stuart has some 
trick blue driving lights.  I hear through the rumor mill that this A2 
Golf will get a Turbo in the very near future, can't wait.
    Finally I had the pleasure to ride in David Schouster's TURBO VR6 
CORRADO.  Rich the owner of EIP took me out and this Corrado is 
beautiful, three piece ABT rims, Zender rear wing, turbo boost gauges.  
When we first went out the Turbo sounded extremely mild, but once Rich 
got on it we were doing over 100 and the car is rock solid.  We came to 
a light and there just happened to be a Vette and we left this Vette 
standing still before I knew it we were doing over 160 mph with only 
7-8 pounds of boost.  That is very impressive I can only imagine what 
this Turbo will do at 15 pounds of boost.  
    I am a beliver in EIP and if you are a Performance Enthusiast then 
you should give them a call.  I plan on purchasing a Turbo system and 
look forward to killing all the Beamer M3's and anyone else that 
doesn't respect the Corrado.
    I am sorry if this a bit long but I am a true enthusiast of 
performance, I have riden in 700 horse power Porsche's from Protomotive 
and I am looking forward to upgrading my Corrado.

Catch you on the flip side

Herman 
       

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Aug  5 03:46 PDT 1996
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Date: Mon, 05 Aug 1996 02:59:50 -0700
From: corblimy@creative.net
Subject: Re: *  eip TURBO VR6 *
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Status: RO

Well, having spent the whole day at various airports throughout the 
country 
and being put on 3 different airlines, I finally made it back to the Bay 
Area a 
couple of hours ago, but with all my baggage missing 
*&@#$%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

   But, as dishevelled and disgruntled as I am, I'll now post something 
more on the 
eip vr6 turbo system as previously promised.  Haven't had time to go 
through my 
pile of email yet, so don't know if this is old news or what, or if 
there's even
much of an interest in this particular product, but here goes anyway:

Main features:
=============
1)  Custom built Garrett T-4 turbo-charger
2)  Custom designed/built high-volume Spearco Intercooler
3)  Deltagate External Wastegate (no plunger/swing valve style)
4)  Custom built SS Exhaust Manifold, Collector & Downpipe - direct 
fitment to cat
5)  All Intake & Exhaust tubing, piping and necessary mounting hardware
6)  Copper Head gasket w/SS O-ring wire (not a double gasket spacer 
plate)
7)  Variable In Dash Boost Control
8)  Optional Electronic Programmable Boost Mapping 
9)  Propietary engine management control 
10) 8-12 psi for street use, 15+ psi overboost option available for race 
applications
11) Compression ratio in the 8-9:1 range
12) Oil Cooler highly recommended!
13) Complete system that can be installed on an unmodified factory 
Corrado, Jetta,
    Golf or Passat VR6.  Features an innovative design that allows one 
to use
    the stock VR6 throttle body, intake manifold, cylinder head, cams 
and pistons
    if desired, or substitute any (or all) of these components with an 
aftermarket 
    replacement of one's choice (eip, abt, schrick, techtonics, 
neuspeed, ams, etc)
14) Projected List Price:  $6000 or less for complete setup

This system has the distinction of being the first US-designed and built 
vr6 turbo...
should be shipping by late August...my unforgettable ride in the 7-8 psi 
prototype 
conservatively suggested ferocious power well in excess of 300 engine 
hp...reliability
and driveability were also given top consideration alongside massive 
power gains, 
tests are now in progress to verify that these targets are being 
met...dyno figures soon!

My current thoughts are that whilst forced induction is not for 
everyone, this turbo does
present an intersting alternative to the stroked and bored route, 
possibly conceding some
low end torque compared to the 3.1 but more than making up for that 
anywhere above 3-4k,
and quite a bit more cost effective when one considers its 400+ hp 
potential...

Cheers,
Edward

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Aug  5 12:52 PDT 1996
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Date: Mon, 05 Aug 1996 12:24:56 -0700
From: corblimy@creative.net
Subject: Re: EIP Turbo with STOCK intake?
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: corrado-l@teleport.com
Cc: Frank 
Reply-To: corblimy@creative.net
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Status: RO

Frank wrote:
> 
> turbo systems must use a different intake and exhaust. And a different
> clutch, etc... Now how can EIP's use ANYONE of these, stock OR
> aftermarket intakes? Does that mean you can also use Schrick 260/268
> cams?
> 

   That's generally true for most systems, but the eip solution is quite 
ingenious as the compressed, cooled air is routed to the t-body instead 
of directly to the head or ports.  Apparently there were quite a few 
doubters (from the competition, perhaps?) who questioned the feasibility 
of this approach, as well as fitment and the adoption of the bigger 
Garrett T-4 unit (instead of the more common T-3)...

   A direct benefit of this is that if you've already invested $$$ in 
something like the Schrick or VWM VSR (or the less costly eip modified 
manifold), there's no need to replace them!  Obviously performance will 
be affected by the sort of intake manifold and cams used, and further 
tests will have to be done by some interested party as to which type of 
manifold (and cams) would integrate optimally with the turbo setup... 
btw, eip does offer a custom turbo-optimised cylinder head which is a 
different design from their big-valve ported head.

   However, you are correct in pointing out that a custom exhaust 
manifold is needed for the turbo, and indeed this is provided as part of 
the basic package, complete with ceramic coating and heat shielding. (So 
hold off on that $$$ Header purchase if you're seriously contemplating a 
turbo!)

>         Could you please tell us WHAT is included for that price?
> Does it includes the Quaife differentiel? Gear ratios? Oil cooler?
> Installation included? Clutch? 15psi+ option cost how much? Etc...

   I'm not eip's Public Relations person (though if they throw in a FREE 
turbo, I'd reconsider... ), so please direct inquiries of this nature 
to them at (800) 784-8100.  As far as I know, extras like the Quaiffe, 
different gears, sports clutch, etc are just that - EXTRAS!  The 
prototype turbo had just a stock clutch, I believe - from my 
own experience, the Sachs, while very "nice" and able to handle big 
power increases, does have a higher pedal effort, affects driveability 
somewhat, and wears out quicker...

>         Why : or less?

   What's the meaning of life??  (Sorry, I'm in a peculiar state of 
conciousness no doubt brought upon by airport fatigue and the aggro of 
having to interact with a number of zombie-like airline personnel...)


> What about the engine's longetivity?

   The jury's obviously still out on that as the eip turbo I looked at 
was the first working prototype (though production is not far off).  As 
you know, a forced induction system will by its very nature put more 
stress on any engine and associated components due to the high heat and 
pressure levels involved. 

   Turbos DO require extra maintenance and attention, not to forget more 
frequent oil changes - probably not recommended for the person who 
doesn't like to periodically pop up the hood/bonnet, or who at most has 
his/her C. checked at the dealer recommended intervals.

   A properly designed and maintained turbo/supercharger system should 
be fine however, otherwise there wouldn't be all those forced induction 
systems running around out there today from the major car manufacturers 
(let's not forget our nifty G60s!).

   And once you've gone for a spin in the eip turbo C., believe me, 
you'll understand perfectly and instantly why I've reported so 
favourably on this juggernaut of a machine, despite being initially 
quite skeptical that anything cheaper (let alone a 2.8 with stock chip 
and cams!) could easily outrun my 3.1L "beast from the west" VR6.

  To tell you the truth, I was actually rather wary of Rich's statement 
of a street C. with a calculated 400bhp potential @ 15psi (after all, 
Porsche got less than 250bhp from the turbo VR6 Sharan, and 240bhp at 8 
psi is the claim for the HGP VR6 turbo unit currently under development 
at ND, though Tim hopes to eventually wring up to 300hp from this kit) - 
but halleluyah, I've seen the light (it reads "eip") and have been 
unashamedly converted, for better or for worse!

  But don't get too excited yet, Frank, I'd wait until eip have finished 
their long-term tests (well, or maybe a couple of weeks...), as with 
any major decisions do your research thoroughly, get more info and 
details on this modification including potential side-effects and 
disadvantages, compare the eip system with other competing units out on 
the market, weigh your options and budget, THEN decide whether this 
route is really for you...

  For, think twice before you ever dare to ask for a test ride/drive in 
the turbo, otherwise you'll find yourself immediately signing a cheque 
(in advance) for delivery of the system as have practically everyone 
before you who have ever experienced that beast with its guaranteed 162 
mph (factory chip-limited) andrenaline rush!  

  Heck, there should be an oversized government warning attached to the 
bloody system, especially when Rich has a tendency to pin the turbo's 
160mph speedometer along windy, single-lane country roads...did I 
recount our impromptu flight, on another occasion and car, over the 
crest of a hill at triple digit speeds? Shooting to about a foot in the 
air, the landing was more fun/scary than a gravity-aided ride at Magic 
Mountain or Great Adventure amusement parks! ;o)

Cheers,
Edward

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Aug  5 17:46 PDT 1996
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Date: Mon, 05 Aug 1996 17:16:46 -0700
From: corblimy@creative.net
Subject: Re: eip? who they?
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: Xiaojhang@aol.com
Cc: corrado-l@teleport.com
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Status: RO

Xiaojhang@aol.com wrote:
> 
>       what do eip standing for, how come they build turbo
>       before any of establish giants like the neuspeed and
>       techtonics? if they really doing such neato stuff,
>       how come the european car, sports compact magazine
>       never mention his good work?

  EIP stands for "European Import Performance Tuning".  Being well-known 
is not always a foolproof indicator that a "famous" tuner does better 
work than a lower profile one.  Each tuner has one or more areas of 
specialty that they are strong in, so simplistic comparisons across the 
board are not always applicable. 

  EIP's strengths (in my view) tend towards complex hard-core engine 
conversions for massive power gains and relative streetability, which is 
not something that you can easily create and mass-produce to the public 
even if they should want or could afford it.  We're not just talking 
about straightforward bolt-on kits or off-the-shelf items from other 
tuners such as ABT either - witness the colourful batches of cars that I 
came across in my 2 days at their shop:  
1)  2.8L '93 Corrado VR6 TURBO (EIP head, intake, Eurospec 6-spd, etc)
2)  3.0L '92 Corrado VR6 (EIP head, intake, t-body, Schrick 276, Genie)
3)  3.1L '85 A2 GTi VR6 (orig. 8v, now w/Corrado dash, cluster, brakes)
4)  2.8L '94 Golf VR6 (orig. 4-dr GL 4-cyl, featured in EC - Nov '95)
5)  2.8L '95 Golf GTi VR6 w/ABT body kit and wheels (turbo future)
6)  2.8L Cabrio VR6
7)  2.9L A1 Rabbit VR6 (not yet completed, owner wants a turbo!)
8)  2.2L '90 Jetta GLi 16v (tall block w/11" brakes, Schrick 268s)
Also other interesting modified cars (Corrados, Golfs and a Passat) were 
lying around the shop's parking area that I didn't get time to check 
out, in addition to unseen project cars such as a 2.1L 16v Turbo Rabbit, 
a 2.1L 16v Scirocco and a host of highly-modified, high-power Corrado 
G60s. 

  To put things in perspective, when I had posted "the first US-designed 
and built vr6 turbo", what I should have added was the key word 
"reproducible" and "production-ready"".  There has of course been a few 
isolated stand-alone turbo VR6s created in the States in the past 
(Europe has already witnessed the births of more than a few turbo VR6s, 
including that outrageously race-tuned French turbo C.), as reported by 
Rally Motorsports and a Canadian tuner. 

  Furthermore, the German HGP unit has been available to New Dimensions 
since last year (waiting for an intrepid customer to push this into 
production), and Ron's Parts were going to do a 3.1 turbo Passat until 
its owner sold his car and upgraded to a Carrera 4... 

  What may be a mite different with this turbo is that EIP's hoping to 
market their system as a complete setup (not a one-time experiment) that 
should be a straightforward installation (hardest thing would involve 
removal of  the head to put in the copper gasket) with various 
configurable performance options that the prospective customer can 
tailor to his/her particular level of modification.

  As for recognition by publications such as European Car, that should 
come in time. To tell you the truth (my personal opinion here), I'm 
rather baffled and disappointed by the lack of interest shown by EC, 
perhaps it's time to look to Turbo or Street Power... 

  After EC made the initial contact about doing an article on my 3.1L 
VR6 back in the summer of '95, they have become strangely reticent about 
going ahead with this, saying things like "oh, we've already featured a 
number of 3.1 conversions in past issues".  Perhaps this true 3.1 
doesn't look anything special compared to some of the cosmetically 
strutting Cs (with bolt-on mods) that they've featured before...

  But I'm afraid to think of the alternative, that you have to be one of 
the "big" tuners and have connections in order to get a feature done, 
especially one that's favourable. After all, EIP's intake manifold tech 
install article has yet to be published, 9 months after its reporting 
was completed back in Nov '95. Politics rears its ugly head...(sorry for 
the rant, guess I'm just a frustrated nobody, the "lowly" impotent 
customer!)

>       may be edward corblimy work for eip, haha!

  Very funny, Xiao.  Seriously though, I do not have any official 
affiliations with any of the VW tuners and would like to remain that 
way.  Obviously no one can be absolutely objective as we each have our 
own personal biases, which is quite alright as long as we're aware of 
that at some level. 

  I certainly think very highly of the innovative products EIP has 
developed for VWs and specifically for the Corrado, hence my decision to 
go with a number of their mods for my car after much research and 
questions.  But it doesn't mean that I consider them to be the best 
thing since sliced bread or that they are perfect in any way! I also 
respect the excellent work many of the other US and German tuners are 
doing, having expressed that quite vocally in the past (and have bought 
from them). 

  Granted, I've heard some other tuners and people expressing some 
sarcasm about the strong wording and impressive power claims in the EIP 
ads, for example phrases such as "simply the best" or "258hp" come to 
mind.

  Having seen EIP's operations at close quarters, may I venture that 
this is simply their style, they're very confident and stand by the 
stuff they're doing and are not afraid to express this, as with the dyno 
figures Autothority presented to them after a full day of chip-tuning 
and tests.

  That may come across as being "cocky" and "boastful" to some, but at 
least EIP really believe that their solution is one of the best (of 
course we always have a right to disagree by simply choosing to buy from 
another company!), and not just another cynical, manipulative marketing 
lie.

   EIP's mods may not be for everyone, and one may not be partial to 
their style, but that by itself shouldn't make their conversions any 
less valid, for how many domestic tuners do you know that has designed 
and developed turbo systems, high-compression pistons and big-valve 
heads for the VR6?? 

>       he also talking  awesome ams head but never
>       try it first so he from ams also, no?

  No, I'm not an AMS employee either. I think that my original post went 
something like this - "have not yet personally looked at or experienced 
one yet, but based on reports, it's AWESOME!".  Perhaps my reporting 
wasn't of the highest journalistic quality, but that's exactly how 
someone who sat in the AMS car with this big-valve ABT head had 
described his experience to me. 

  Granted, there has been some strong comments expressed on this list by 
several people who have had negative experiences with AMS in the past, 
but to be fair, there are also other people who have voiced their 
enthusiasm for Marc and his work...

>       i want also turbo but only from good company.

  As do I and quite a few others, that's why EIP would be up there on my 
priority list when it's time to do a 3.1 turbo  ;o)

Cheers,
Edward

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Fri Aug 16 12:27 PDT 1996
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Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:54:21 -0400
From: Vincent Shek 
Subject: Re: VSR
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: corrado-l@teleport.com
Cc: gti-vr6@indiana.edu
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Message-Id: <96Aug16.150145edt.20488@janus.algorithmics.com>
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 <3214DF55.74EF@voyager.net>
Status: RO

I agreed, I would not sacrifice the free-revving VR6 for more low-end
torque. 

Randy Hubbard wrote:
> 
> FWIW,
> 
> I'd like to see ALL of the dyno data on these tests. VWM claimed a good
> 20 ft/lb. torque improvement in mid-range with virtually the same top end
> HP, using their VSR. While I agree there are some options that would make
> a nice increase in top end HP, and improve mid-range, I don't for a
> minute believe 48 ft/lb. torque and 20 HP, in an otherwise stock 2.8L VR6
> engine from the VWM VSR intake manifold/chip.
> 
> It's possible Schrick has skewed the torque/HP curve by using a very long
> inlet runner as the primary pipe, ala Audi. This generates big torque
> gains but kills the top end HP. Perhaps that's why the HP peak is at 5392
> rpm. While this looks impressive on paper, and has great benefits for
> automatic trans vehicles, it's akin to driving your "Father's
> Oldsmobile". No more free reving VR6, just quick acceleration up to 5400
> rpm, then you hit a brick wall and the engine falls on it's face. Doubt
> this is the best combination for most enthusiasts, but it's great for
> towing a boat or trailer... :-)))
> 
> Based on my experience, if EVERYTHING in the engine was optimized, you
> should be able to develop about 200 ft/lb. of torque and about 205 HP.
> This is with all the variable whisles and bells for cam timing, exhaust
> tuning, dual-stage induction, etc., etc. It ain't cheap to get from 178
> HP to 205 HP and meet all emission and federal regulations without
> increasing displacement from 2.8L. It can be done, and this would be a
> more "balanced" engine that provides the best of torque & HP for most
> drivers. If you're interested, send me a letter of credit from your bank,
> and we can start engine development... :-)))
> 
> Regards,
> 
> On the 'Bahn,
> 
> Randy, a.k.a. BoltMeister
> 
> **** See VW/Porsche/BMW Interest at: HTTP://HOME.AOL.COM/RACEWARE1 ****

-- 
Vincent Shek 
mailto:vincent@algorithmics.com -- Toronto, Canada

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Fri Aug 16 11:54 PDT 1996
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Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:36:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hulda Jowett 
Subject: Schrick update (no chip yet though)
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Alright you've all been patiently waiting, and even though i don't have 
the proper chip yet (although I tired a friends chip and it helped), I'll 
do a rundown of the schrick manifold.

First and foremost, this manifold is made for A3 cars only, that's right 
it does not fit Corrados. Huh? you say. There's a small dent (not visible 
from the outside of the hood) in one of the hood support thingys. My 
friend dropped the hood when we were done installing, opened the hood 
later, hey look a dent, guess it dosen't fit quite right. Nice of ron to 
tell me this (not). O'well. little touchup, barely notice it.

There's more here, the EGR hookup to the manifold does not quite line up, 
you have to trim the tube, and bend it smigde. thanks again Ron for 
telling me that. What's that? You want to change your sparkplugs? Well 
you have to remove the manifold to do that (that's right no holes for the 
wires). Now now, it's not as bad as             
it sounds. the manifold is cast in 3 seperate pieces. This allows you to 
remove only part of the mainfold (easy 1/2 hour) to access the plugs. The 
benefits of this design outweigh the disadvatage of the plugs. first the 
manifold is easier to cast this way (less expensive). second, the holes 
for the plug wires are a compromise, easy access for some restrction. 
                                        
As you've already guessed, the directions leave somthing to be desired. 
They are a single page, and basically say mount manifold. mount vacuum 
resrvor in an appropriate spot. attach control box to rev counter. end
 
The manifold looks very similar to the VSR. There's a big Schrick logo 
cast into it, right above the runners. You can't remount any of the trim 
pieces (VR6 DOHC, spark plug looms, etc.). The runners are staggered. 
The runners for the rear cylinder bank are shorter than the runners for 
the front. They are round (kind of like 16V runners), instead of being 
flat like the stock manifold and VSR.
                                                  
Power gains? Power starts building at 2k rpm. By 3k you have 7 hp, it 
then starts to drop back to a 1hp gain at 4k when the flap opens. then 
starts to build again at around 4500, after 5k you have about 4hp, 6k it 
up to about 8, 6500 it reaches 16hp (you really feel that!). This is al 
according to aaron at APS.  As I said before, I tried my friends chip, it 
helps the flat spot alot. It's a custom chip which has VSR programs and 
stuff on it. There was no longer a sudden drop when the flap opened. 
Instead it mellowed out slightly at this point, then started to really 
pull at 5k, not 5800 as before. this coinsides with the dyno figures 
(which by the way, are without cams) from APS.  while talking w/ Aaron 
about this, he said to just send him my chip, and he'd reprogram it. 
he also slipped out that the 260 is the BETTER cam. No low end loss like 
the 268, peaks at same RPM, it just drops off faster after 6500, not much 
point in going past 6500 anyway.                   

Worth it?? I don't feel any of the VR6 stuff is worth the money, never 
mind this piece. The engine is just so efficient right from the factory, 
you just can't get decent power for for the $$. On the other hand, this 
piece is a true have your cake and eat it too (despite the cost) just 
like the 260 cams. You get don't sacrifice lowend for high, or high for 
low. You get both, and in that respect this is a good piece of of 
equipment.   
                                                            
Later!

Brian

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Aug 26 23:57 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 02:32:17 -0400
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Re: EIP 3.1 litre problems?
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: spwhite@artsci.wustl.edu
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In a message dated 96-08-26 09:28:14 EDT, you write:

<< The gentleman I was talking to had a few friends that had gone to EIP from
 california to get the mod done.  He said that they burned up "cases" of
 oil when driving their C's now.  He seemed to think that since the VR6
 has such a different engine design that EIP's pistons were not designed
 properly and thus were unable to seal properly even with new rings and a
 honed cylinder wall.
 
 caveat: this is the same gentlemen that is working on an APS/Neuspeed VR6
 supercharger setup for the VR6 so he might be a bit biased..
  >>

I feel compelled to once again tell the long and detailed story 
of the evolution of the EIP 3.1L VR6, but I will spare the bandwidth.
I suggest that all interested in this particular thread search back to 
a series of posts regarding the forged piston vs. cast piston debate 
a couple months back. During that discussion I candidly answered 
the question about oil consumption by stating that YES Edward's 
3.1L was consuming too much oil and were going to update his 
pistons with our latest (and greatest) third generation set of 
VR6 pistons. 
Lets not forget but Edward’s car (the one being referred to by this 
"unknown" source at APS) was the FIRST true 3.1L ever built in the 
world (as far as anyone knows). And 258 HP/253 Ft Lbs. torque at 
the front wheels wasn't too bad either !! (Autothority in VA, 1995)
His car being a prototype was the ONLY VR6 we have built (beside our 
original 3.0L test sled in 1993 -thanks Steve) that had any abnormal 
oil consumption what so ever !! And we have built a lot of VR6 engines 
since Edward’s. Many already have fairly high mileage on them and all 
with ZERO oil consumption problems. 
Many different factors weighed into the design changes that have been 
made to our VR6 pistons. Longevity, Oil consumption, Noise, Strength, 
Weight etc. are all important issues that we looked at very carefully 
when designing the latest EIP VR6 Piston sets. 
We have gone as far as having custom rings built, custom wrist pins, 
using the latest most costly aerospace coatings and more. We are very
confident  that  we  offer  the absolute finest VR6 piston set  that money 
can buy. We NEVER take the easy way out. 
By the way Edward’s pistons are of course being replaced at no cost to him
as part of the workmanship warranty that we offer on all of our performance
products. But we will be replacing the 11.0:1 units currently in his car with

low compression versions that work with his custom Carrillo rods (sitting in 
front of me on my desk...man they are sooooooo sweet!!) for use with...YUP 
you guessed it, a 3.1L TURBO !! I'll keep the list informed as the dyno
results
from this combination should be rather interesting. The French better watch
out !!
Sorry for the length, I lied about sparing the bandwidth.
-------> RICH !! <-------...helping to keep the oil on the inside...


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Sep  3 22:10 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 21:00:36 -0700
From: Edward John Thai 
Subject: Re: EIP 3.1 liter problems?
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
To: Bob Schwartz <73621.3420@compuserve.com>
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Status: RO

> We started talking about the 3.1L, seemed a bit
> concerned bout his oil consumption and some kind of
> stumbling thing in his car. Said the car was actually a
> prototype so there were some bugs that would be fixed.
> Have heard since then his car was really running
> on 4 cylinders then due to clogged plugs!

  Yes, I remember chatting with you, Bob, as I had mentioned at the
time, my car was indeed a first generation prototype and so experienced
some problems after about 4,000 miles of usage.  In fact, my Corrado was
at its worst during that particularly blistering-hot day, not helped too
much by running the engine at 140mph+ down I-5!

  The 3.1 was so down in power that day that I found myself completely
and frustratingly unable to pull away from Qui's G60 when we made
several extended top speed runs against each other on the Californian
freeway!!  (It was only above 125mph or so that the G60 started to fade
a mite vs the big VR6)  Even Jason L. commented after driving it that
the car felt nowhere near the mega-power machine that it had been back
in Maryland...

  Fortunately this oil consumption mis-behaviour and the resultant power
loss has been remedied in subsequent conversions such as the
half-a-dozen 3.0s and a couple of 3.1s that eip has done since. That was
one of the reason why I took the 3.1 back to eip for "debugging",
completely at their expense for all parts, labour and cost of delivery. 
Of course I got slightly side-tracked from my original goals of getting
new pistons and a Genie header by that ever-so-seductive turbo... 
   
> Aaron took off with Edward in the 3.1 for a
> test drive, don't know what happened but
> when they came back, some of the Neuspeed guys
> were trashing his car saying it was nothing special.

  Hmm, I'm rather disappointed to hear that, especially since Aaron was
so helpful and informative during our drive. We were basically trying to
determine the reason for the stumbling, so Aaron just slowly and
steadily (no all-out acceleration runs!) drove the car around trying to
listen and feel for anything which may provide a clue.  

  As far as I knew, Aaron himself was really friendly at the time, we
chatted about some of his upcoming mods such as the low-resistance wires
and of course the Schrick VSR, and he encouraged me to take the 3.1 down
to Camarillo for a free dyno session.  I wasn't aware of his employees
reportedly making negative comments about my car, but if true, guess
that's just the uglier side of politics between most of the VW tuners,
it's sad because I think they would all have much more to gain by
working with each other to provide us with better quality service and
parts (and respect/satisfaction from us customers which translates to
increased sales and therefore profit)... 

  For example, I really look forward to the debut of the (rumoured) APS
supercharger, I think it's super that we VR6 performance addicts now
have a choice of forced induction conversions - supercharger systems
from APS and TEC, turbos from EIP and a couple of other tuners
developing similar kits, they all fill distinctive needs for different
people!

Cheers,
Edward

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Mon Sep  9 22:04 PDT 1996
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Date: Mon, 09 Sep 1996 21:51:25 -0700
From: Edward John Thai 
Subject: More 'bout the eip turbo vr6 (and other yummy power options)
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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For those of you who may be interested in the progress of the eip 2.8
VR6 Turbo (if not, please ignore or delete this performance-oriented
drivel ), the test car recently went up to about 12 psi of boost, and
what a difference that made!  From a "rolling start" of about 60-80mph
on the beltways, Dave's turbo Corrado reportedly "destroyed" a new Supra
Twin-Turbo, then proceeded to humiliate a significantly souped-up 300ZX
turbo, and for dessert, ate up a supercharged Z28 that had previously
run a solid ET of 12.2 seconds. In fact, at the 140mph mark, none of the
aforementioned rivals were even close (believe me, they were all still
desperately trying at that point!).  All this with just the stock chip
programme, factory cams and pistons in the C....

   Steve's 3.0 C. last recorded a 13.57 sec 1/4-mile (exit speed of
104.1mph), which isn't half bad for a big-bore, radically cammed,
top-end oriented machine.  Of course he won't be happy until he breaks
the 12-second barrier, at which point the teasing about his drag racing
skills (whilst under stress) might actually terminate...NOT! ;o)  btw, 2
of these eip 3.0 VR6s have gone to AMS customers, one to the mid-west,
one up to Michigan, and another one to Saudia Arabia!  

   For aficionados of low-end torque who may not be as seduced by the
relatively cost-effective high-rev power of the eip bored 3.0, there's
always the stroked abt 3.0 to consider as an alternative, as exemplified
by some of AMS' project cars such as Mike's 3.0 which will soon have a
turbo hanging off it to keep up with his TEC-supercharged M3...and
according to Frank's exclusive report about GTA's secret project, it
appears that there are now 2 true 3.1 kits available, from eip and abt
respectively.  Not to mention the eip turbo and the aps supercharged 2.8
VR6...hmm, the outlook does look rather rosy for those C. enthusiasts
who are also serious performance mod devotees, lots of delicious options
to choose from, if only one can afford them!

Cheers,
Edward

From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Tue Sep 10 18:36 PDT 1996
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Date: Tue, 10 Sep 1996 13:45:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: corrado@intermind.net (Michael Balasko)
Subject: APS Supercharger
Sender: owner-corrado-l@teleport.com
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Well, you didn't hear this from me, because some hacked and pirated my account.
The APS Charger is a VORTECH, not a paxton unit. As soon as I can, I'll spill
my guts as to what I know. 

Mike 


From owner-corrado-l@teleport.com Sat Sep 14 21:59 PDT 1996
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Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 00:52:21 -0400
From: EIPTUNING@aol.com
Subject: Turbo System Updates
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